Rabshakeh Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, HutchFan said: But there is also a sinister side to it too: the overt cultural appropriation, the rebel flag waving aspects of it that are so ugly and vile. But that's a part of the story too. And, of course, it didn't just happen with Dixieland. Particularly weird given that the same movement had at some points close links to civil rights groups. Clearly that was part of the appeal though, for whatever reason. Along with the stripey blazers. 1 hour ago, HutchFan said: In my experience, the most interesting revivalists are the pianists. Art Hodes, Don Ewell, Dick Wellstood, Ralph Sutton, Dick Hyman, Dave McKenna. Hodes and Hyman I know fairly well, but what record or records would you start with for the others? 1 hour ago, HutchFan said: I dig that you guys are digging into this stuff. Not because I think it's all good music. (Not at all; there's plenty of junk.) I just like how you're poking around in all the rooms in the house of jazz -- even the places that are normally ignored. It's just interesting how much of this stuff there was, and how important it was (in the sense of sales as well as the number of listeners, critics and players invested in it, and just how much of "Jazz" it represented in cultural terms). It has now just gone. It is not just that interest has waned (as with swing and many other non-jazz genres), but it has been almost completely forgotten and then dropped from histories, where it appears only as a competing movement to bebop. Strange to think about. Almost as strange as the idea that classic jazz revival could once have been a chart topping trend. Edited March 24, 2023 by Rabshakeh Quote
Quasimado Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 2 hours ago, Peter Friedman said: Some of the best Hawk to be heard - plus Tommy Flanagan is there. Quote
HutchFan Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said: Hodes and Hyman I know fairly well, but what record or records would you start with for the others? Dick Wellstood and Dave McKenna and Don Ewell and Ralph Sutton and Edited March 24, 2023 by HutchFan Quote
BillF Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 9 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said: Fantastic! Thank you. Have you tried this? Or these? Quote
Larry Kart Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 10 hours ago, HutchFan said: I dig that you guys are digging into this stuff. Not because I think it's all good music. (Not at all; there's plenty of junk.) I just like how you're poking around in all the rooms in the house of jazz -- even the places that are normally ignored. In my experience, the most interesting revivalists are the pianists. Art Hodes, Don Ewell, Dick Wellstood, Ralph Sutton, Dick Hyman, Dave McKenna. As for Dixieland: I've never really gone there. I think I have two Dukes of Dixieland records (one of them features Pops) and that's it. ... It was an odd phenomenon, wasn't it? I get the sense that Dixieland took root in colleges in sorta the same way that the Folk Revival did, that being able to play/participate in the music was part of the appeal. ... But there is also a sinister side to it too: the overt cultural appropriation, the rebel flag waving aspects of it that are so ugly and vile. But that's a part of the story too. And, of course, it didn't just happen with Dixieland. Two great sources for somewhat revivalist jazz that's terrific are foreign -- the Australian stuff that originated in the 1940s by the late Dave Dallwitz, the Bell Brothers (Roger and Grahame) Ade Monsborough et al. and the more recent French stuff from Jean Pierre Morel and his Le Petit Jazz Band and its orchestral offshoot. Different as they are, these guys get it right -- nothing is within quotation marks. Dallwitz in particular is a composer in the Morton class. Morel's stuff is or used to be available via the Stomp Off label. As Terry Martin (himself an Australian who grew up around Dallwitz in Adelaide) shrewdly pointed out in the Oxford Companion to Jazz, one key reason thus stuff works so well is what might be called the "so near, so far" principle, in terms of time and geography. Distance in those realms tends to preclude futile Turk Murphy attempts at outright emulation and leaves room for fruitful personal engagement of sensibilities. One Dallwitz album to go for first is his masterpiece, the "Ern Malley Suite." "Gold Rush Days" and "Gulgong Shuffle" are also choice. "Ern Malley Suite" seems to be on You Tube. Maybe more Dallwitz too. He also was a gifted painter. Quote
HutchFan Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 (edited) 19 minutes ago, BillF said: Have you tried this? Those are all terrific recommendations, Bill. But they're the ORIGINALS, not revivalists. If you're gonna go down that path, then you've gotta throw some James P. Johnson in there! 11 minutes ago, Larry Kart said: Two great sources for somewhat revivalist jazz that's terrific are foreign -- the Australian stuff that originated in the 1940s by the late Dave Dallwitz, the Bell Brothers (Roger and Grahame) Ade Monsborough et al. and the more recent French stuff from Jean Pierre Morel and his Le Petit Jazz Band and its orchestral offshoot. Different as they are, these guys get it right -- nothing is within quotation marks. Dallwitz in particular is a composer in the Morton class. Morel's stuff is or used to be available via the Stomp Off label. As Terry Martin (himself an Australian who grew up around Dallwitz in Adelaide) shrewdly pointed out in the Oxford Companion to Jazz, one key reason thus stuff works so well is what might be called the "so near, so far" principle, in terms of time and geography. Distance in those realms tends to preclude futile Turk Murphy attempts at outright emulation and leaves room for fruitful personal engagement of sensibilities. Thanks for the recommendations, Larry. I've been meaning to investigate Dallwitz forever, but I've never gotten around to it. Now playing: Earlier: R.I.P. Edited March 24, 2023 by HutchFan Quote
Rabshakeh Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 25 minutes ago, BillF said: Have you tried this? Or these? Now, but this is the really real stuff. 18 minutes ago, Larry Kart said: Two great sources for somewhat revivalist jazz that's terrific are foreign -- the Australian stuff that originated in the 1940s by the late Dave Dallwitz, the Bell Brothers (Roger and Grahame) Ade Monsborough et al. and the more recent French stuff from Jean Pierre Morel and his Le Petit Jazz Band and its orchestral offshoot. This is great! Graeme Bell is known to me as a name but not the others. Where would you start with each of these artists, record-wise? Quote
Larry Kart Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 I said "somewhat." Morel's orchestra actually plays the compositions and arrangements of U.S. writers of the '20s. The results sound great and fresh, not revivalist in the restrictive/constricting sense. Quote
HutchFan Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 Next up: with Richard Williams, Charlie Rouse, Sam Jones, and Al Foster Quote
jazzbo Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 2 hours ago, jazzbo said: Okay, time to move onto something I really want to hear through the new DAC: Miles Davis “Bitches Brew” Sony Quad/Stereo SACD. Disc 2 This is the original mix. I still just seem to gravitate to the original mix, even though I like the remix. Now disc 2 Quote
jlhoots Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 On 3/20/2023 at 1:59 PM, Rabshakeh said: Jason Moran - From the Dancehall to the Battlefield Looks very interesting. I can only find the CD though his YES label. $25 + tax & shipping. Trying to decide. Quote
Rabshakeh Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 1 minute ago, jlhoots said: Looks very interesting. I can only find the CD though his YES label. $25 + tax & shipping. Trying to decide. You can taste test on Bandcamp, if that swings it. I quite enjoyed it. I love the source material and have for years. I thought the more piano, the stronger it is. Some of Moran's performances are really special. The sections with a larger band are a mix. Some parts are very strong and lusty, others feel a little more academic. Quote
jlhoots Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 7 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said: You can taste test on Bandcamp, if that swings it. I quite enjoyed it. I love the source material and have for years. I thought the more piano, the stronger it is. Some of Moran's performances are really special. The sections with a larger band are a mix. Some parts are very strong and lusty, others feel a little more academic. Thanks!! Quote
John Tapscott Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 1 hour ago, HutchFan said: Next up: with Richard Williams, Charlie Rouse, Sam Jones, and Al Foster IIRC this album got a bad review in Downbeat, but I think it's a good recording. 8 minutes ago, felser said: 👍 Listening now: Quote
jazzbo Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 (edited) Came in the mail yesterday from discogs. Man a previous owner really wanted you to know HE owned this one. He wrote his name in sharpie on the booklet cover, the disc itself and even on the unprinted flip side of the tray insert. Never saw that much identification before. This is a very nice Kenny Burrell album. To my ears Kenny is wonderfully consistent. So many nice albums, some incredibly great ones. Kenny Burrell “Round Midnight” Fantasy/OJC cd 600×600 153 KB Edited March 24, 2023 by jazzbo Quote
HutchFan Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 Los Dos Lados de la Típica '73 / The Two Sides of Típica '73 (Inca/Fania, 1977) with Sonny Bravo, Alfredo De La Fé, Nicky Marrero, John "Dandy" Rodriguez, and others Quote
Dub Modal Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 Keeping the Kamasi Washington listening going with Harmony of Difference, Space Travelers Lullaby and Heaven & Earth. All better than The Epic. He seems to adopt more of Pharoah Sanders' tone as these albums progress. Quote
HutchFan Posted March 24, 2023 Report Posted March 24, 2023 Next up: Machito Orchestra con Lalo Rodriguez - ¡Vamos A Bailar! (Discos Caballo) originally released as Fireworks (Coco, 1977) Quote
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