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Chappaqua Suite


medjuck

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Just listening to this one this morning. Looks like someone has it for sale on Amazon for $499.99.

:blink:

Why hasn't this seen wider release in the US?

I don't think it was ever a legit release.

The French CBS twofer was a legitimate release. The production of the album was supervised by Henri Renaud.

Then it is strange that it never came out in the states.

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Has anyone seen the film this was the soundtrack to?

Saw it on late-night TV a few years back... struck me as very self-indulgent. Much prefer Ornette's soundtrack, which I snagged as a Borders musicseller around the same time (re: Chuck's post, didn't the guy who made the film say something to the effect of, "Ornette's music was too beautiful," or some such? :rolleyes: )

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Just listening to this one this morning. Looks like someone has it for sale on Amazon for $499.99.

:blink:

Why hasn't this seen wider release in the US?

I don't think it was ever a legit release.

The French CBS twofer was a legitimate release. The production of the album was supervised by Henri Renaud.

DMG has a copy of the French CBS release and/or a CD-R copy for sale:

DMG

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I think the question of "legitimacy" is a dispute between Conrad Rooks and Ornette. Rooks made the record deal with French CBS and Ornette felt he had been paid for a soundtrack but had not been paid for a record.

I heard that the record company did a major editing job on the recording and he did not approve. I'll do some searching later and see what I can dig up that isn't a rumor on the Yahoo list.

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I think the question of "legitimacy" is a dispute between Conrad Rooks and Ornette. Rooks made the record deal with French CBS and Ornette felt he had been paid for a soundtrack but had not been paid for a record.

That may be true and would be interesting if it's the case.

I was referring to something totally different, however - a shopowner who burns his LPs and sells them at $15-$20 a pop. Including the album in question.

Edited by clifford_thornton
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I think the question of "legitimacy" is a dispute between Conrad Rooks and Ornette. Rooks made the record deal with French CBS and Ornette felt he had been paid for a soundtrack but had not been paid for a record.

That may be true and would be interesting if it's the case.

I was referring to something totally different, however - a shopowner who burns his LPs and sells them at $15-$20 a pop. Including the album in question.

I knew Manny is an idiot. Why doesn't he just copy the CDs? :rfr

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Guest akanalog

well it would be nice if record companies would make the music availble.

if i want a copy of "juba-lee", how much is an LP going for? probably a lot.

so i am fine paying $15 for a well done LP to CD transfer. i prefer CD format anyway.

i would rather a legit CD reissue, but there isn't any.

also i am not sure it is actually manny who is doing it since i at the last WFMU record fair there was a guy selling even more of a selection of the CD-Rs who didn't seem to be DMG associated.

this is a guy on ebay who sells vinyl burns-i sent you that marion brown one, cliff.

that guy sucks. he doesn't even track the CDs usually and uses scratchy vinyl.

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also i am not sure it is actually manny who is doing it since i at the last WFMU record fair there was a guy selling even more of a selection of the CD-Rs who didn't seem to be DMG associated.

The two I have from DMG are very nice. There's a Sun Ra and a Frippertronics that sound amazing.

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I think there are a number of people doing it, but DMG by selling them in a store seems more dubious than just random weird dudes. As far as I can tell, it's either Manny or Bruce's records that are being used for the ones they're selling there. I also think that if you're going to burn/rip shit, it should be a trade circuit. But what are you gonna do? I'm diggin' Le Temps Fou, so I'm not saying I'm not partly guilty for owning something ripped for profit (sounds good, too).

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I heard that the record company did a major editing job on the recording and he did not approve. I'll do some searching later and see what I can dig up that isn't a rumor on the Yahoo list.

The story is that there was much more composed and arranged orchestral music than what was released on the CBS release. All of the accounts of this that I have read on the internet have been second and third hand. AFAIK, no one has said they have first hand knowledge of this or that they have heard the unedited material or that it definitely still exists in some recorded form. Also, no one seems to know who was in the 11 piece orchestra.

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  • 6 months later...

Legal issues aside, if there was ever a logical time for Legacy/Columbia to reissue this set, it would be now. Ornette now has a Grammy and Pulitzer to his name — buzz words for better or worse — and interest in his back catalog might be at a peak.

You can actually fit the 2-disc set onto one disc — mine clocks in at 79:48 I think. This would lower production costs, I'm guessing. At any rate, I just listened to all four parts of the suite back-to-back a few days ago — uninterrupted! — and was blown away all over again.

Chappaqua Suite is not only undervalued in my opinion, but I think it has Charles Moffett's most elegant playing (with Ornette) on record. On the Golden Circle recordings, Moffett sounds like a basher — exuberant, but with a fondness for thrashing away at his ride cymbal, and generally staying at one consistent dynamic level (i.e. "loud"). On Chappaqua Suite, he really steers the band (trio and orchestra) with a finer delicacy, changing tempi at times not unlike (in spirit at least) Tony Williams.

It probably won't happen, but a U.S. release, done right, would be another fine honor for Ornette. Of course, Ornette himself would probably be against the project.

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It probably won't happen, but a U.S. release, done right, would be another fine honor for Ornette. Of course, Ornette himself would probably be against the project.

You honor somebody by releasing something against their wishes only if you do it after they're dead.

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If we're talking Ornette albums in limbo, then we should at least get to The Great London Concert first--that might represent some of the trio's best material, overall. And then there's Who's Crazy, Crisis...

And honestly, I'd be even more excited if Ornette started releasing new records semi-regularly again.

Edited by ep1str0phy
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Well, with the way Chappaqua Suite was recorded, it might as well be Ornette, Moffett, and Izenzon via stairwell.

Honestly, though, I'd be interested in hearing Ornette's approach to group music with musicians (such as AACM members) whose ideas are far more "in tune" with other group musics. Case in point: Ornette + Jackie on New and Old Gospel. Case against? : Ornette + Garrison/Elvin (on a lot of) New York Is Now and Love Call, although it's certainly an interesting collaboration on numerous levels.

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I agree, too, but at this point I'll take anything, and novelty is a part of that. I think the recent "Ornette explosion" has spurred a mad-dash to documentation, but things feel a little uneven when a few great bands have just disappeared from below. Did you happen to catch the Ornette/Charnett/Denardo trio? I mean, I love Geri Allen, but that trio was hard--in its own way, a challenge to the (dare I say it) 60's trio.

Edited by ep1str0phy
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