Michael Fitzgerald

This is similar to the approach used by WBGO, which I discussed in the "Why I Stay Pissed" thread recently. They want consistency - homogeneity - so that when "casual jazz listener" (not the serious fan, because he's not the target) happens to tune in, whether 8 AM, 4 PM, 4 AM, that listener gets the same predictable sound. This station takes things a bit further by automating, but that doesn't surprise me at all. WBGO went from having qualified DJs with personalities to hiring musical incompetents and sending them to voice classes. The personality lobotomy was pretty easily mandated by the program director with the homogeneity rule and the associated playlist restrictions. Mike

"Generally" speaking, both standards and jazz standards are part of the repertoire of jazz musicians. So are originals, so are collective improvisations, etc. But there are fairly easily made distinctions that I believe are helpful in the discussion. Broadway tunes have a life outside of their jazz interpretations. These jazz versions are invariably alterations - they've been "jazzed" up. Harmony and melody and rhythm are NOT the same as what the composer wrote. You can find examples of jazz guys doing the same thing to folk tunes, classical pieces, etc. Sonny Rollins did compose what quickly became jazz standards - Oleo, Doxy, Valse Hot - but his interpretations of Broadway tunes doesn't all of a sudden make those tunes into jazz standards. "There's No Business Like Show Business", by virtue of its birth, will remain something borrowed from a non-jazz world, a standard, never a jazz standard. Jazz standards are designed to be jazz tunes right from the start. They've got the appropriate harmony, melody, and rhythm. They're written by jazz musicians. I'm definitely not the only one to make this distinction. It's addressed in New Grove under "standards". Very few pieces that can prove jazz "pedigree" have become "regular" standards. We've discussed this here (and elsewhere). Some pieces by Ellington, Waller, Legrand, Mandel - not many jazz guys have been able to cross into the true mainstream. Mike

Yes - going back to Berigan in 1938, maybe even earlier. The Bix list you need is here: http://ms.cc.sunysb.edu/~alhaim/recordingstributes.htm Mike

I'd say the proliferation of the small independent labels as well as the artist's ability to do self-issued CDs is another factor in this. With a big record company, there was someone from Artists & Repertoire calling the shots (or at least exerting some influence). Now, the artist does what he wants, for better or worse. And I do think the distinction should be kept between standards and jazz standards. Golson and Silver never wrote a standard. Broadway never produced a jazz standard. Mike

I don't think it's a question of *writing* standards at all. There are plenty of good tunes that fit the bill. It's a matter of people playing those tunes, having a decent number of different people playing the same tunes over and over. It's in the best financial interest of an artist to record original material. Why give money to somebody else when you can keep it for yourself? So as things are, probably 80% of all the tunes on a new CD never get recorded again. The remaining 20% consists of the obligatory hackneyed overplayed standards - Body and Soul, All the Things You Are, Autumn Leaves, On Green Dolphin Street - and the retreads of jazz standards drawn from the repertoires of Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Duke Ellington, et al. and any other kind of tunes not yet mentioned. When it comes down to it, there are thousands of fantastic tunes just waiting to be recorded a *second* time - stuff going back to the 1950s and 1960s. Mike

I think Atlas Shrugged is a pretty good book - but if so many people are reading it I can't see the effect on the world. Unless they're all practicing how to be the bad guys instead of the heroes. Maybe all the women are fantasizing about running railroads. Maybe that's why they read it on the subway. Mike

This is exactly right. The station does their thing - if you like what they do, you support them; if you don't (or if you're a cheapskate freeloader) you don't. If you really don't like what they do, you don't listen. I had an interaction with the program director of WBGO a few years ago (I was described by some present as having "fired both barrels"). He claimed the state of jazz radio in the NYC area was just fine, I disputed this since WBGO has become an intentionally homogenized station that has policies against playing music from before 1950 and anything "too out". How could this be a good thing? Well, it turns out that "good" means quite a different thing than I had imagined. I was told, "The goal of a radio station is to gain listeners" - not to present a balanced representation of the artform, not to make the serious fans happy - just to gain listeners. Quantity, not quality. Because that's what you take to the funding folks to get your money. Numbers. In the end, I came to the conclusion that our fundamental positions are so diametrically opposed that argument is useless. Mike

Yes - isn't that how the Blackhawks originally came out? Just trying to set some context for that period. Mike

Have a look at the Contemporary Records listing - 20 out of the first 100 issues were under Manne's name (not counting albums where he was just a sideman). http://www.jazzdiscography.com/Labels/contemp.htm Mike

Ooooh - spoohky! Mike P.S. Tigger's voice had been taken over by another guy a few years back.

Yes, still married to Moran. But I think the above is quite inaccurate. Corea was involved as early as 1968, while he was married to his first wife, Joan (of Tones For Joan's Bones). I never heard of any interaction with Moran until 1976. Moran had been with Mahavishnu Orchestra in 1974. Maybe he met her through Scientology. Mike

Listen, if those folks can bring Kirstie Alley back from the dead, maybe they are worth paying attention to! Mike

Wow - you dislike NO ONE? You like EVERYONE? I can't fathom that. Now, if only you had unlimited financial resources, you could save jazz! Or kill it - I'm not sure. Mike

http://home.snafu.de/tilman/faq-you/celeb.txt Konitz, Clarke, DiMeola, Brubeck, as well as Corea are mentioned as having present or past involvement. Mike

Well, it was more than that. Anthony Braxton has spoken about Corea's Scientology evangelism. Can't access it right now, but it's in "Forces In Motion" by Graham Lock. Someone else can look up the specifics. Braxton was the reluctant holdout; Holland and Altschul went along with Corea, at least for a time. Mike

Other issues may include: Stefan Bauer: Coming Home (1002) Ulli Junemann: Let's Call It A Day (1017) Berne, Baby, Berne (2001) Only the last seems to be closely linked to the Harry Edison (he's on it, along with a host of similar folks). It's a retrospective of the Berne Jazz Festival. Not sure if this Village is related to the label that reissued classic 1920s material. There are a few others that do not seem to be related. Mike

August 29, 1940 Mike

Negative Mike

Sorry - it was reported that WARM refused to have their set recorded. But maybe that means they have plans for something. Mike

Basically 1953-1957. Since *small group* has been specifically mentioned, that omits a number of dates (including "Sings Johnny Mercer" and "Sing And Swing" definitely and "This One's For Basie" perhaps). About 7 sessions including a live quartet date. Only one of these has Buddy singing, not playing. Not sure about the inclusion of the "Krupa Meets Rich" album - probably, I would think. Mike

Unfortunately, there were no quality horn players available, so Rich got stuck with some guys named Harry Edison, Benny Carter, Milt Bernhart, Georgie Auld, Willie Smith, Thad Jones, Joe Newman, Ben Webster, Frank Wess, Sonny Criss, no-names like that. Mike

NYT obituaries, Monday, June 27, 2005 p.B6 - Paul Winchell, 82, TV Host And Film Voice of Pooh's Tigger http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/27/movies/27winc.html John Fiedler, 80, Stage Actor And Film Voice of Pooh's Piglet http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/27/movies/27fiedler.html As for the threes, it seems not. The above two gentlemen were the last of the original film voices from the Winnie The Pooh films. Mike And no, I'm not buying that these are the 2nd and 3rd following Thurl Ravenscroft.

Well, now you'll never be able to tour Germany. Mike

Yes, the Cellar was a club in Vancouver late 1950s. Not to be confused with the Cellar Cafe in NYC (mid 1960s) nor the Cellar in Toronto (slightly later 1960s) nor the Cellar Door in Washington, DC (late 1960s-early 1970s)....... The Hope trio with LaFaro and McBrowne accompanied Sonny Rollins at the Jazz Workshop, SF in the first part of October 1958. When Rollins left, Harold Land came in. I can't confirm whether the Vancouver tape is from around that time or from earlier in 1958. Mike

I didn't get to hear all, but during the discussion, I thought Lennie McBrowne was named as the drummer for that tape. Mike