by the way, Larry, saw you mentioned Charles Olson some posts back - his simple statement "an object is its own meaning" was, for me, the key that unlocked contemporary forms from music to literature - idea, I think, was to stop looking for self-imposed layers of meaning and to simply see/hear what the author/composer was saying - kind of like "he has nothing to say, only a way of saying it" (either Robbe Grillet or Beckett, sorry, can't remember) - it's all a mantra I find necessary to repeat whenever something, at first glance, puzzles me -