P.D.

See this thread Tubby Hayes Possibly the best place to start is Big Band... 100% proof Quartet ... Mexican Green These are both Fontana reissues Japanese styleThe Jasmines feature early Hayes.. still worth seeking out, once you've got the two above, or picked up the Hayes habit. The Jazz Couriers were a two tenor group , frontlined by Hayes and Ronnie Scott.. Hayes occasionally changing the tone with flute or vibraphone contributions. Most of their albums were reissued on Jasmine too There was one on Carlton.. currently available via Fresh Sounds The Jasmines.. if not easily found in American stockpiles, are still fully listed on British websites. Hayes USA recordings ( with Clark Terry and Kirk)are also worth it but are generally OOP Read the above link to an Org. thread which warns of possible mis representation of the Costanzo album as being a full Hayes performance. I am not a member of IAJRC.. but would appreciate details of what to expect on the proposed 2CD set. I understand some peoples reservations about Hayes.. Branford Marsalis was not too complementary in a Jazz Review BF test.. but Hayes remains one of the top British Jazz performers in any style..... And we love to promote him whenever possible.

At first I thought you might be referring to the Bayou club recordings, but I see from the literature that Roy and Hawk recorded with Joe Jones ( not Philly Joe) in Buenos Aires June 16 1961. Body and Soul was one of the tunes. These are aparently part of a West Wind CD entitled Jazz Festival in Latin America.. there were 6 tracks, Body was a feature for Hawk, The Man I love for Roy. Love for sale a trio for Tommy Flanagan. The rest of the Cd was by other artists. This may be what you have or some bootlegged verion of it.

O.K I dug out my $3.00 used comp album.. its actually mainly American artists ( Ella, Sarah, Jimmy Smith, Blakey ) I was surpised that this Tubby piece was included as part of the package. There is a solo on Southern Suite part 1, and no bongoes Part 11 is Bongo driven, it's subtitled Chase and Capture, and there are long tenor solos in it which at times sound like two different people, although there is no overlap, nor any 4 bar etc. exchanges. The Coda certainly sounds like two different tenors.. unless Tubbs was doing a split personality bit. Requires closer listening to confirm. Nice arrangement but not really outstanding. I wouldn't pay Dusty prices for this track alone, though for completists it is Tubbs composition and arrangement.

You guys popped in while I was editing my post The Tubbs discography lists Unknown personnel for the Southern / Equation album, so the second tenor is not identified. Though Lord list a Frank Reidy and Phil Goodie also being there on tenor, Ronnie Ross on Baritone... Maybe Ronnie played tenor on that track as I know nothing of the other two.

Beware the " Equation in Rhythm " CD.. unless you are an absolute Tubby completist. It is actually a Jack Costanzo record and Hayes plays only on Souther Suite parts 1 & 11. I have these tracks on a British Comp LP but as yet haven't played them. I suspect Hayes may only solo on Part 11 as this is included in a comp album ( which might be also one of the new issues I'll have to check the groove listings) Tubbs Tours is a big band set.. the tunes are titles based on Cities etc. around the world. It is a good album, worth having but not up to 100% Proof or the small group Mexican Green I think the "Tubbs" album is the Introducing Tubby Hayes album recently reissued as a vinyl album on Epic. The song titles are the same Palladium Date is only half a Hayes album. The original LP had three tracks by Hayes on one side. The reverse was 6 songs by Cleo Laine... Hayes is not present on the Cleo sides.. so unless you are a Cleo follower too, this is an expensive proposition for a Hayes collector. The Comp is King Tubby.. it has tracks from all of Hayes Fontana Albums ( including only Souther part 11 ) and therefore not really worth investing in if you have, or intend to have, the other Fontana albums.

My error, the Goodman appears to be a "normal " Mosaic. ( I had to go back and check.. 3CDs of Goodman's Columbia output seemed way too small) these are listed in the 2004 and beyond category Freddie Slack was responsible for Will Bradley's (?) Beat me Daddy Eight to the Bar which set him on a somewhat Boogie influenced path. He used Ella Mae Morse on some of his records, which is a bit of a plus, but in general I think there are many more relatively neglected artists far more deserving of Mosaics time and efforts. Similarily I feel that there is plenty of Goodman Columbia out there already.. the Christian box having quite a bit in it for one. These could well be two Mosaics of little interest to me.

As per my comment in the Where Is thread......... The current Jazzmatazz listings of upcoming issues lists the following potential Mosaic Selects Freddie Slack Benny Goodman on Columbia Seems a bit of a departure for the selects, though not the " traditonal " Mosaics I predict that the Slack may sell as well as the Hackett Go for it Lon

One of the many friends that I made during my addiction to Jazz BBs, brought this thread to my attention via an email. If B3’er wishes to besmirch my lily white character and reputation, I wish he would NOT do it by posting references to selected threads, but more fairly by linking ALL the appropriate threads… unfortunately this would require AAJ postings which were lost in the hack attack. I left the BB’s in DEEP despair Not because of personal insults from the purveyor of prurient interest.. I doubt that there are any who could insult me enough to put me off my beer and / or Jazz, but because I was tired of seeing the boards reduced to the lowest common denominator, taking on the appearance of a group of tittering children, giggling over schoolyard vulgarities.. rather like small British infants who discover that shouting “ Knickers” loudly will cause concern in the adult population. ( if that is beyond comprehension see the Lennon reference in I am the Walrus ) I was somewhat bemused by the fact that Org set up a separate thread to confine Deep within it. Years ago when I lived in St. Louis, the city zoo had a famous gorilla in a cage. It produced copious amounts of fecal matter which it took great pleasure in hurling at the tourists and visitors to the zoo who crowded around the cage to see the beast. The knowledgeable regulars stood at a safe distance, out of line of the projectiles, but totally enjoyed the discomfort of those recipients of the scatalogical attacks. Somehow this strikes me as a fitting analogy to Deep’s tenure here. Alas it seems that he has outstayed his welcome here to. Whatever happened to the concepts of free speech?????????????? I see he is now running rampant through the European BNBB.. perhaps I should don my pith helmet….. Three or Four months withdrawal, cold turkey from the boards, has left me less addicted. I miss some of the regulars.. quite a few who also seem to have taken a leave of absence. The topic content of all the boards seem less interesting now, but in fairness the Org threads do seem to have a bit more meat than others elsewhere. However until something really inspires me.. perhaps Mosaics announcement that they will issue the Complete Jonah Jones Capitols, or perhaps a Compendium of Ace Cannons finest moments, I shall a lurker remain. In the meantime, I would prefer that B3’er took a leaf out of Paul Harvey’s book and told either the rest of, or the complete story.

Well DEEP , I have emails that say the opposite. I thought I should email Mr Ricci and ask his permission to reproduce them here.. then I thought better of it... BUT another traveller of the boards has posted over there, Ricci's " supposed" statement to you. It could be true.. it could be false... But I could post his emails to me about you...which were not complimentary What value would it have? Very little.. you're basking in your self centered glory that you are The Man of the Jazz Bulletinn Boards 4000 views of a piece of shit.. doesn't make it it jewel... it remains an often viewed piece of shit...... I really wasn't against you I complained.. if that's what it was.. about Bombastics attack on you... Jeez I was upset at the vehemence of his attack... but the turn of events since.. and your self serving posts, the lies you perpertrated when you came to this board to belittle the other one... has totally soured my stomach of you and the boards I visit. Gloat away... Maybe I'll be as rude as you and post Ricci's comments to me.. about you.. without his permission. and fuck ( you like that word) the bulletin boards.. Yours truely P.D. the MotherFUCKer Get a fucking life... get some humanity... FUCKING grow up!!!!!![/size =14]

Sorry for my laziness.. Both Envoldsen and Klee are listed as playing tenor also.. Now I will have to pull that album out, to see if there is indeed any part where more than one tenor plays outside the ensemble.

I have this album, but must confess to not having played it for a long time. Your question interested me too and I did a search in the Lord This is what I found. Both dates were under Marty Paich's leadership Nov 9 1955 Candoli,Envoldsen,Harry Klee ( alto / flute) Cooper/Jack Dulong bari/Paich/Joe Mondragon bass / Art Madigan drums Tenors West Ballet de Bongo ( Costanzo added on bongo) Paich-ence Con Spirtto The Dragon Mardi Gras Nov 10 same band but Giuffre replaces Cooper There is No You A Train Line for Lyons Shorty George Jacqueline So it would seem that the tenors don't play together ( it'll be hell if there's a tenor sax chase chorus somewhere ) I haven't got the album in front of me, so I don't know if the tracks are arranged Cooper one side, Giuffre the other, or just mixed in. As these are Paich dates, it would be interesting to know, from a discographical point of view, if it was intentional to feature two different tenors, or if Cooper was unavailable for the second date and Giuffre was called in. Hope that helps.

Each year I host the Granfalloon in the Seattle area. Started slow, but growing.. The Door prizes are rapidly becoming Collectors Items. This year I think the theme will be The Bebop Preservation Society A live band should now be part of the event. Though way too early,this is a serious invitation.. to board participants. I can guarantee good food ..Beer, cheap wine, music and hearty debate ( especially if Deep were to show up.. Aric has threatened twice, but backed out at the last minute each time..and he's more or less local) but cannot offer travel expenses or accommodations, though pitching a tent by the sport court might be an option. Enough room for a motor home ( small) or two If interested we can try to work out a date suitable to the majority. PM's / emails fine Fellow founder Shawn, will attest that I am not a serial killer or prone to spiking the Kool Aid.

If you have to ask, you'll never know Somebody said that

I wonder who get's the Parson's Nose

A couple of comments before I retire from this discussion 1 There is a "report this thread" button tacked on to every post. Would you Conn, not get involved in trying to correct behaviour that was seriously detrimental to the board?? 2 The events on the AAJ board were not an isolated incident but numerous threads that had sunk to an abysmal level , little to do with music, a lot to do with less than decent behaviour. 3 I did not contact Mike until Bombastics post and the reaction it created.. hence it actually was a violent , vulgar attack on Deep that set me off. I doubt I was the only one to write to him and other than my public posts here I have not made any other comments behind the scenes to operators of this board 4 I did not ask for , nor advocate that anyone be banned, nor is that my intention here 5 I would not have started posting on this topic had Deep not tried to imply that he was banned for one simple, interesting and relatively innocuous post and that there seemed to be those here who believed that, that was indeed the case 6 Yes Moose the Jazz BB's are a relatively small community. I consider myself as much a part of it as you. I know you frequent other boards, but there were obviously people here that bought the false image that Deep was trying to present of himself as a persecuted person. I guess my post was part of getting the story out. I apologise if I offended your intelligence, and appear to be invading your domain. Once again there is nothing in my posts that is calling for the exclusion of any member from any board. I now will cease to discuss this further.

O.K. Deep, or Wingy . or should I call you Sybil? I didn’t want to get into this, but your description of the turn of events at AAJ which resulted in your banishment needs to be corrected. The downfall began between Jazzypaul and Bombastic. The latter had an aggressive response to other posters that can only be equalled by your own, the difference being that your attacks are often humerous, while his never were. Both these two took to having derogatory terms about the other as a subtitle to their board name. The Mark Edelman thread was going on insult after insult all this time. Over 15 pages I believe. At about this time, you in your ongoing search for attention, and seemingly constant desire to infuse any topic with sexual overtones, introduced a thread on Gay Jazz Musicians.. I forget the title but it was generally phrased in “ street” language. In itself it could have been an interesting topic.. it was handled that way on the old BNBB. Comments that certain musicians played with a renewed vigor after exiting the closet and similar observations were pertinent. Unfortunately Bombastic took serious offence to your implication that Grappelli was gay.. your response was abusive. Bombastics was over the wall.. I wish I could reproduce it here, but unfortunately it has been deleted.. however it referred to you and your father joining in sexual activity with each other. He voiced this in very graphic slang terminology, but it’s meaning was obvious to anyone. You rose, or should I say, stooped to the challenge It was at this point that I wrote an email to the owner of the board asking if he was aware of the degeneration that was occurring. Please Note.. I did not request that either you, or Bombastic be banned, only that Mike might take a look at the direction the board was taking. The Gay thread got out of hand, as did the other threads that sprung up to discuss the problem.. generally propelled by your posts. The Gay thread was closed. You responded with the Blow Job thread.. no doubt seeking some other topic of questionable viability to see how far you could push the envelope on a board supposedly dedicated to discussions of music and other topics in a public forum. You dragged many into it..they followed your lead, each trying to out do the other.. What is that expression about the Lowest Common Denominator????? During this period Mike and I had exchanged a couple of emails, from which it was obvious that he had been unaware of the state of things. The Blow Job thread got to a proportion where it too was capped. Your response……. the Back of the Bus thread.. which you started off with the Chameleon liner notes that you reproduced here. It had potential of being of interest but you tried to persuade others to join in and get into descriptions of sexual activity during gigs etc. that could only appeal to jazz followers with a prurient interest in the musicians involved, and frankly of little value. Citing a post by Gdogus where he refers to thread does not tell the whole story.. once again there was nothing in your Chameleon post that you reproduced here with comments that this was the reason you were banned, that warranted the punishment. Your attempts to create the image that it was for that post, and that post alone , that Mike took his action is a total lie, and typical of the approach you seem to revel in… Once again, I would not be engaging you on this topic, had it not seemed that certain board members here read your Chameleon post and responded as though they believed in the image of a prude AAJ that you were trying to project with your lies. These Boards are about the All About Jazz system in one instance, the Organissimo Band in the other and music, especially Jazz in general. Your comments and the place you take boards to, does little to enhance the reputation of either. No Deep I am not a prude, I like a blue or good filthy joke as well as the next person, I have used language that would make a drunken sailor on a 24 pass in Singapore blush… but if your criteria for a “good” bulletin board is to be able to say fuck and graphically discuss sexual activity, aberrant and otherwise freely, I suggest you avoid Jazz bulletin boards where the owners may be seen as responsible for your activities. This could negatively impact the health of their sites, and in this case B38’s band. I happen to like having Jazz bulletin boards around..left to your own devices and control, they would soon disappear. Stupid I might be, hell why not.. but Deep, to my knowledge you have been banned by at least two boards.. possibly more. If you haven’t yet realized that the fault might be your own, and not always attributable to the board users or administrators, you are also stupid. To think you can always lay the blame at their door, when the only common factors in the events that result in your banishment are yourself and an obvious taste for vulgarity and confrontational posts, indicates that your intelligence level is far less than mine.

So Deep, as you haven't responded in any way to my post this morning on the Chameleon thread, I assume that you agree with my observations that it was a blatant attempt to mislead and mis inform board members here, who had not actually seen the mess that was made on AAJ.

Once again

I have these, but have not seen them in a long time. The 5 disc Profile set had bout 2 discs worth of material from the Last Sessions ( one of the reasons I was disappointed in it ) though how much was from vol 2, I don't know exactly.

Your comments here are absolute bullshit. It was not in any way shape or form that the Back of the Bus Chameleon post caused Deep to be excommunicated. It was the language used in and the constant vitriolic vulgar exchanges between Deep and Bombastic. Perhaps the degeneration of the Gays in Jazz thread, or the Tunes to do Blow Jobs to, by might also have contributed to the banning. That the banishment was fair or not might be open to discussion, but please do not mislead people with the concept that AAJ was restrictive about any of your comments in the above " album notes". Unfortunately all of the offending threads have been deleted, or I would have cut and pasted some of the comments here. The reason I am taking this tack, is not because of Wingy's misleading comments, but the responses of those of you who should know better.

I remember when Jazz CDs first came out, I think the titles were a lot crappier than that. They seemed to be on "specialist" labels, perhaps Jim is correct with DMP ... maybe Denon were in there, but the regular labels seemed to be late entering the game. Most of the early CD's , my memory, tells me were comp type albums, or recordings by lesser artists. I had a large LP collection and was determined not to change to CD.There didn't seem to be too much issued that was of interest. Was in the Jazz Record Mart in Chicago one day and they were playing Jelly Roll Morton's Burnin' the Iceberg over the speakers. Burnin was the first Morton I ever bought. On a 78 when it was reissued that way in Britain, back in the 50's. I knew it backwards. I had never heard it so clear, blew me away. It was from a comp ( I hate comps) by Robert Parker... I know his digital manipulations are not popular with the audiophiles now, but the clarity he brought to those old recordings back then was sufficient to make me run out and buy a CD player, even though it seemed at the time that CD issues were still way behind what was being issued on LP. I was converted. I have the same feeling about converting to SACD.. oops that'll set Greg off

I used to communicate with Bill ( Road Guy ) a lot, but haven't heard from him for a long time. I wrote emails to him which were unanswered. Anybody know if all is well with him?

Every photo I have of Eldridge shows hiim right handed.... perhaps they are all reversed.. Mosaic is always accurate.. It could be a rare image of him deliberately playing left handed, after all there's guys like Clark Terry who played chase choruses with themselves, holding a trumpet in one hand and a flugel horn in the other. Which side did Little Jazz part his hair on?

It looks like the first half tracks 1 - 7 might be from the famous Sound of Jazz TV show. The complete show is available on DVD but the image quality, obviously from the tape recorded source, is way below par. If this new DVD has better visual and audio characteristics, it may be worth trying

Fresh Sounds / Blue Moon Is the site in Spain www.boulevarddistribution.com is a USA source. The discs are a bit cheaper from Spain, but interestingly enough, often Boulevard will have OOP titles. With Boulevard it seems best to call them over the phone to order though