Rooster_Ties

As far as dates from OOP Mosaics go, I think if they wanted to do a Larry Young date, CONTRASTS is the way to go (clearly), over the only other Larry Young option (Heaven on Earth). Or if they wanted another Andrew Hill date, COMPULSION!!!!! seems like the best choice (and supposedly high on Hill's list of favorites). Out of the Jackie McLean set, I'd really like to see IT'S TIME, since that's one of Tolliver's very best side-man dates from the 60's. (And with interest in Tolliver starting to ramp back up, with the Select, and his being on the new Andrew Hill date - there'd be a lot of logic in putting IT'S TIME back out there again. The Byrd/Adams and Blue Mitchell sets haven't been OOP that long, and most of that material seems better suited for the RVG series anyway. (And the more obscure (Conn-like) dates from the Byrd/Adams and Mitchell sets seem like they'd not be such incredible sellers anyway. I'm thinking of that one Byrd/Adams date from the late 60's, with Chick Corea. Someday, maybe, but not after the set just went OOP less than six months ago.)

How's this book?? I'm afraid I heard about it once, or else maybe saw the cover in a store (and I guess didn't have time to even pick it up and read the back cover). Maybe I saw "road manager" - and wrote it off, possibly too hastily??

My first priority for Conns would be Natural Essence, with a substantial portion of the "trainwreck" as bonus tracks (or else why bother reissuing it, since it's been out in Japan). Some have argued that only Water would touch it -- but look at the line-up, and tell me this isn't Conn-worthy: Tyrone, Woody Shaw, James Spaulding, Kenny Barron, Reggie Workman, and Joe Chambers. Not one single player (other than TW) who wasn't on dozens and dozens of other key recordings during their careers - including a TON of dates for BN (collectively). Also, Water hasn't done bonus tracks on anything to date (that I know of), so it would seem the only way to get at least some of the "trainwreck" out there would be to go the Conn route. Also, I might mention this quote (from another board) is about as much as almost ANYONE knows about how "it" sounds... I don't care if all of "it" gets released (the take with vocals, for instance, can stay in the can), but I sure do hope the rest of it gets out someday -- and a Natural Essence Conn is its only hope. (And remember, we got a TON of unreleased Andrew Hill over just the last couple years -- some of it kinda rough too -- so I think there's real hope yet for the trainwreck.) I could list a few more titles I'd like for 2006 Conns (October probably? - getting to be an annual event), but I'll let some others plug their favorites first. Also, don't forget, if the recent past is any indication, I think there's a darn good chance that one or two of the 6 Conns will be of dates that have never been on CD before (except as part of some Mosaic set -- presumably one that's currently OOP now). So, what are your two favorite sessions that have never been on CD in the US, except as part of an OOP Mosaic?? And what else are you dying to get on CD, finally!! Have at it...

Thanks!!

David, can you share anything about the bonus material that might be released on/with Paper Man?? (meaning the quintet date with Herbie). Alternates?? Or extra tunes?? Or both?? How much extra material (time-wise) might there end up being added?? Also good to hear that the two Big Band dates might be reissued again someday (sooner than later, hopefully).

Well, I put in my BIG order with Mosaic yesterday, just in time to both take advantage of the new sale, and also to get the Jazz Times promotion (1 year for $5) before January was up. I got the Mobley and Turrentine "big" sets, plus six Conns total for only $9 each (Dance with Death, Andrew!!!, Fuschia Swing Song, Contours, Tex Book Tenor, and Easterly Winds). And I also got four Selects: Curtis Amy, Carmell Jones, John Patton, and Charles Tolliver. Yeah, I spent way, WAY too much. But the way I figure it, I "saved" $86 off of what the exact same sets would have cost me if I had waited until after the Selects went up $5 each in July, plus the savings from the Conns being so cheap. (Also, I would have never ordered so much all at the same time, so I added some shipping costs in there - to reflect the same purchases spread over three separate orders.) Or in other words, I "saved" 17.6% off of what the same stuff would have cost later, spread over three orders. And unless there's some AMAZING sets that come out soon -- sets that are MUST HAVE (and MUST HAVE 'EM NOW!!! ) type items -- I'm pretty sure I won't be ordering anything else from Mosaic for probably the next two or three years.

Warning: A few of the ads on this site might not be safe for work -- but the content I'm linking to is just fine for all!! This scanner has been modified or hacked to play Fur Elise with the sounds of the scanner's motor (from crapville.com) alternate link for a .wmv file of the same content (sans ads and such).

Which Bjork tune?? - if I might ask.

Thanks for the info everyone!! By the way, I've got the Strata East "Impact" from '75 (the big band date). Had it for years. It's the enja "Impact" (the live quartet date) that I was previously unaware of until last night. (And I thought I knew of practically everything Tolliver had ever released - at least certainly all his leader dates). Don't have time to check now, but I don't recall the Cowell tune "Brilliant Circles" ever having been recorded by or with Tolliver.

You don't have any private tapes, Dan?? Or receive or distribute Blindfold Tests?? Your poll questions make no allowances - for anything. How about taping things in the past? I'm not claiming these exceptions are justified. I'm simply asking about behavior. I would be surprised if anyone on this board could answer #1.

Just to be on the safe side, I just assume everybody's ignoring me. (unless, of course, someone happens to pay attention to me. )

I'll bet a nickel that this thing at Tower has gotta be the Strata East "Impact" from '75 (the big band date). It's the '72 live quartet date on enja (of the same name "Impact") that has me puzzled --- not a date I'd ever heard of before. Who releases two very different albums with the same title within like 3 years of each other??

source #1 IMPACT (23-03-1972) by charles tolliver Songs Impact, brillant circles, prayer for peace, truth Play by Charles Tolliver (flh), Stanley Cowell (piano), Ron Matthewson (bass), Alvin Queen (drum) CD Album ENJA 2016 source #2 Charles Tolliver - Impact (Live) Label: Enja Records Catalog#: enja 2016 ST Format: LP Country: Germany Released: 1972 Genre: Jazz Style: Hard Bop Credits: Bass - Ron Mathewson Drums - Alvin Queen Fluegelhorn - Charles Tolliver Piano - Stanley Cowell Notes: Rating: 4.0/5 (1 vote) Rate It Submitted by: mranta Tracklisting: A1 Impact (7:58) A2 Brilliant Circles (15:48) B1 Truth (9:06) B2 Prayer For Peace (15:56) ===== I presume this has never been released on CD, right?? Anybody here have this, or heard it?? Here's the cover of the Enja date, live in 1972 (and one of the sides)... And here's the cover of the much-better-known Strata East date (of the same name), though the Strata East date was recorded in 1975, and included a big band plus strings (and had different tunes).

oh.

A scam I just got at my work e-mail (from which I've never used Paypal at all, never!!!). But the address the link actually goes to is... http://80.154.19.133/www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscrcmd_login.php which, of course, has nothing to do with Paypal.

You don't understand what "mechanical rights" are. They have to do with the publishing of the song and the use of the music and words, not the recording. They obviously paid the mechanicals if the song is in the movie. Welcome back Chuck!! This place ain't done been the same without ya.

Welcome (BB)!! Thanks for your offer - which I may well take you up on. Another book I've been meaning to get... Bowling Alone : The Collapse and Revival of American Community Robert D. Putnam, paperback edition 2001

By the way, as you may have guessed - my query was mostly just academic. I certainly wasn't worried about my hypothetical handbell-choir arrangements of Radiohead tunes, not in any real sense. I mean, said handbell-choir is a church-affiliated group, and the tunes in question wouldn't even be performed in any kind of commercial context. Never the less, this is a facinating discussion.

This looks very interesting, and I'm afraid I'll forget about it later. Amusing Ourselves to Death: Public Discourse in the Age of Show Business by Neil Postman 20th Annv edition (2006) - originally published in 1986. And HERE's the introduction to the 20th Anniversary Edition, by Postman's son - Andrew Postman... -- Rooster Edit: I figure we can consider this a place to publicly "bookmark" links to the books we're considering.

So, let me see if I've got this... As I understand it -- a band or individual can legally play anything they want to, written by anybody else -- so as long as it isn't recorded, sold, or broadcast. (And "theoretically" the ASCAP/BMI fees that live music venues have to pay cover this - which I know is a whole 'nother can of worms.) But if you actually write down the arrangement on paper (in order to play it) - there's a legal problem with that? Or maybe I'm reading too much into that "should always obtain written permission" that you said, Sangry.

By the definitions in the poll choices, even someone like Chuck (who I'm sure is way closer to "pure" than all of us are - combined!!), is still defined as being "weak" and/or otherwise "self-justified" in his "morally, ethically and/or legally questionable" behavior. And someone else who buys a bunch, but then doesn't give a flip if they burn a whole bunch more too (even if they realize and admit that it's wrong) -- is then somehow grouped into the same category as someone like Chuck? How could that make any sense?? I make no claim of sainthood in all this - just that my behavior is a hell of a lot closer to Chuck's. And yeah, I resent being classified the same as someone who burns stuff right and left, but then self-justifies their behavior because they're poor, or cuz they think they've given enough money to "the man" already, or cuz they wouldn't have bought it anyway even if they had the money - or whatever stupid-fuck crazy justification they can think of.

And while we're at it, is there any copyright violation if someone got a friend of theirs to do an arrangement of a tune neither one owns the rights to (let's say a couple Radiohead tunes), in order to have them played by some other group - heck, how about a church handbell choir?? Let's say the arrangements are fully scored, but are never sold. Is there any problem with this?? Would it be any different if the friend was paid to do the arrangements?? Purely hypothetical example, of course. I mean, who would ever be crazy enough to try to do Radiohead on handbells??

How did the Real Books get to be so ubiquitous?? (Hope this isn't too much of a thread derail.)

It's the loaded language of the poll that bugs me, as does the grouping of all the different "gray areas" (some very dark, and some much lighter) into one big "gray area" -- implying that everything that isn't "pure" is all the same. It isn't. And re: downloading ---> to the best of my knowledge, I've never downloaded any music that was otherwise in print. And when things I've downloaded get back in print, I almost always buy them. (The only exception is if I didn't care enough for it the first time to have even kept the downloaded copy.) Edit: And I almost always buy at least a drink or two at jazz clubs (even when there isn't any minimum), and I almost always tip $1 per drink. You gotta vote with your dollars, doncha know.

OK, getting back to music (and the extremely limited choices in this poll)... I'm minutes away from pulling the trigger on getting the new Charles Tolliver Select (plus a whole bunch more from Mosaic). I already own legal/legit issues of both the Live at Sluggs and Live in Tokyo material. And I don't give a flip about any possible sonic upgrade to the material (the ones I have now sound just fine). I'm only buying the new set because I want the 3rd disc of previously unreleased material. (I'll probably just give away my two legit Strata East discs to a buddy of mine - an "underpaid"/"underemployed" jazz musician friend of mine to whom I owe a few favors.) And I want to support Mosaic. I have another friend who already has the Tolliver Select, who I could have EASILY burned the 3rd unreleased disc from. He even offered to loan it to me if I wanted to. But I'm just about to shell out $39 for probably about 75 minutes of music that I don't already own -- plus about 140 minutes of music I already do own. And when faced with these kind of decisions, 99 times out of 100 I choose to do the right thing and buy or "re-buy" the material. And yet, my only choice in this poll is to vote that I am "weak" or otherwise "self-justified" in my "morally, ethically and/or legally questionable" behavior -- because I happen to own burns of probably a couple dozen OOP titles -- among something like 3,000+ legit and legally purchased CD's. FYI, I'm moments away from dropping over $400 on a Mosaic order ($400 I really shouldn't be spending on music), when I could easily burn most of it from friends of mine. You're damn right I sleep good at night.