skeith

Doesn't anyone want to talk about the PRESTIGE box for Christ sake? It only has Bud Powell, JJ Johnson, Gene Ammons.....

What box set is this? You're not being very helpful ... Sorry Dan since there was a thread on this before, I thought people might be aware. As Chuck said, yes it is the early Prestige material, killer stuff - in my opinion! I picked it up yesterday - so far sounds better than previous incarnations.

I probably don't qualify as an informed opinion. I did see them live several times in NYC. my favorite recordings are: Live Dreher, Paris 1981 Communique

Chris, as a former Clevelander, I think moving to NYC is tough for most people- it's too big, too in your face, too dirty, too chaotic, too so many people. I like a lot about NYC but I don't know that I will ever get used to all of it. My wife was ready to leave until we moved to Westchester and since then she has found it tolerable- it is just a little bit less in your face. Not sure if it applies to your situation, but might be a solution for your family.

This is the worst NYC summer in the about 20 years I have been here, almost the whole time it has rained and even when not it has been full of dark clouds.

Kevin your post was indeed poetic and very touching. condolences.

That's too bad. I really love the Dinah stuff and actually have it in a couple of different forms. She had a fanatastic voice. As far as Desmond/Hall, that was my first Mosaic and words cannot describe the beauty of this music. Hmmm, I can sort of understand. But I *love* the albums with Merrill & Vaughan and also enjoy the strings album quite some. The jams I think I've played maybe twice so far, only (I've had the box for some 7 or 8 years, I think). But still this is a great box set. I wonder: is sound on the Verve Master Edition reissue better, or even much better, so that maybe some favourites should be bought in that form as well? (I used to have some of the old Polgygram CDs before getting the box, so I don't know any of the VMEs.) Ubu, I had the box and then sold it after hearing some japanese 24 bit mini lps and Verve Master Edition versions of the same material. I thought they were better and I did not feel I needed all of the material on the box. In some previous thread this was dicussed.

the acting continues - give the man the Academy Award!

I don't know if the "you" that you mention in your post is always referring to me. I note for the record that you don't counter any of my comments about bloody faces, diving, and poor reffing as being part of the "beautiful game", so I take it you are admitting those points? Am I allowed to make any comments? Hey, why do you assume I don't care for soccer, as I said I watched quite a few games, even taking some vacation time to watch them and I don't feel it is an inferior sport. I have attended several professional soccer games, though not in the US. My point was that I think there are certain elements of the game that are not appealing to many Americans- the diving, the fouling, the inconsistent reffing. And I take your point about the stretcher being used to quickly speed off a player, but hey once these guys get to the sideline they are miraculously hopping around. My point here is that in soccer many injuries seemed faked or at least overdramatized in a way that does not occur in the NFL and several European and South American soccer fans who were watching the World Cup with me did not disagree with that point.

Well as an average American, I think it is a beautiful game -potentially. But maybe not this World Cup and I think plenty of the Europeans on this board have been saying the same thing. I watched about 10 games from start to finish. I defer to others on this board, especially the Europeans, whom I am sure know more acbout soccer than I do, but I see nothing beautiful in De Rossi's elbow to the face of Brian McBride and all the blood on his face. And I think a lot of Americans see nothing beautiful in the rather frequent diving we have been treated to. My god, we see these guys diving when there has not even been any contact. Say want you want about the NFL, but when a guy gets taken off the field in a stretcher, he's not coming back to the game. Here in this World Cup, how many guys go off the field in a stretcher as if they are about to die, and they are back in the game 2 minutes later? I think the overall impression of the soccer games in this World Cup is that too many of the games are decided by penalty kicks resulting from rather questionable penalties which certain players seem to be looking for, rather than playing the game. A prime example of that was the Italy -Australia match, where it certainly appeared that the Italian player purposely tripped over the Australian to get the penalty kick. The officials deciding what is and what is not a penalty seem to be inconsistent from game to game. And like some on this board, I lamented the red card to Zidane, and I think that if he was taunted by Italian players with derogatory comments about his ethnicity, well that just sucks. Sure Zidane should not have lost his head - but I am more sympathetic to him when I hear about these circumstances. Finally, I do think that goals scored on penalty kicks (whether in the shootout at the end or even during the game) just aren't as impressive as the goals scored during regular game. They just seem easier to me to score as long as the goalie goes the wrong way. That goal Italy scored during the game was more impressive than ZIdane's penalty kick, but they detract from it all with their constant faked penalties.

Absolutely correct!!!

Have a great one

McLaughlin and Williams are so ON during McLaughlin's solo that it's ridiculous. No wonder Larry Coryell thought John was the best guitarist he'd heard in his life. Larry Young's solo sounds pretty wild too but he's buried in the mix. The recording quality is nowhere near "unlistenable" but it's really tragic that you can't hear Larry's (presumably) magnificent playing. Guy I agree with you on these points Guy.

Happy 4th to America and everyone!!!!

Well because of all this ruckus I went back and purchased the cd of the Tony Williiams Lifetime "Emergency" I had this album in the 70s, bought the cd , but then sold the cd some years ago. And let me say that while I think the players on Emergency are greater than Saudades, I think Saudades may actually be a better album. But I will say that the instrumental numbers are better than I remember, but the vocal numbers are worse (for god sake - do not insult Hendrix!!) and the most pathetic aspect of the vocal numbers are the lyrics- who wrote these- Neil Diamond or Rod McKuen? with every sort of hip cliche and bad rhyme they could think up. As for commercialism, I would imagine this album was criticized for being that and several tunes veer into the sort of bad rock group sound. The most uncompromising tune is Sangria for Three and yes - no compromises there. But most of the tunes are not particularly complex or out and I think less so than early Mahavisnu Orchestra. I suppose the most dissonant player is McLaughlin and he is playing stuff few rock guitarists would play and it is raw and Larry Young - well it sounds like he is inside of a tin can. As for Tony being "deep black" - well I am always wary of this concept. I can't imagine many blacks supported this band and when I hear blacks saying they hear nothing "black" in Jimi Hendrix or the World Saxophone Quartet - and also say they thought some white artists were black - well then I just don't know... I can't say I am thrilled with the way the drums sound on Emergency! None of Tony's compositions on Emergency are as memorable as "Pee Wee' which he wrote for the album Sorcerer. Trio Beyond had the good taste to put that tune on their album.

Chuck, what in particular, do you dislike about Saudades?

Well I do remember some of my problems with the orginal "Emergency" lp being Tony's singing and the generally poor sound of that lp.

I am a big fan of Clifford Brown! sad anniversary.

Well given the level of acting that appears to be exhibited by the Italian players it is just amazing that Italian theater is not more internationally reknowned. These guys deserve Oscars! or something better.

Here's the other big mystery. Why am I responding so well to the Saudades cd, when I have never reponded well to "Emergency" and the other Tony Williams Lifetime cds that inspired it? Anyone else in the same boat?

Not exactly sure what you mean about this title cj? and what is your point about the relation to the manager are you saying that Saudades is the name of the agency? I know this a portuguese word which means "sadness/longing" something like that. I thought it might refer to the loss of Tony - but the nature of the tune which is very rocky/bouncy certainly does not reflect the name for it, if that is what you meant.

Still diggin' this one a lot. but just another random thought to add To me the title tune of the CD "Saudades" is a blatant rip off of Miles's "Spanish Key" Anyone else hear that?

He also on Unity. That's an understatement 7/4 - it was his album!

ok guys I had thought of the Larry Young connection, but the cd was specifically a Tony Williams tribute and to some extent a tribute to the band Lifetime. I don't think Lifetime ever played "If" or did they?