JSngry

Just as a listener? How's about as a human?

Eric Burdon War Edwin Starr

Is there anything between Point A & Point Z? I know you can do better than that... Based on what has come out about Richard's "personality", I think the odds are less that he's a "Racist" in the sense of being a White Supremacist, card-carrying KKK type as they are that he's spent his life so wrapped up in himself that he's failed to develop any type of empathy for all but a select handful of people. That's a situation that a lot of "creative" people find themselves in, and although it's necessary up to a point for the creative process, if it goes on too long & too unchecked by the reality past the end of their nose, it ends up becoming a type of generalized misanthropy. It's not "racism" per se, but it's definitely every bit as fucked up, every bit as hurtful to/for all concerned, and every bit as much in need of a smackdown. Perhaps even moreso, since the list of potential victims of such a mindset extends to pretty much everybody.

Over the years, I've come across more than a few devotees of Hard Bop (players & fans alike) who've said that the first+ genertion of bebop sounds "nervous", "jerky" or other such things. While I can certainly relate tht to some of the music, I myself think that with the exception of early/mid-50s Sonny Rollins and some Mobley from the same time, nobody had such a refined & loose grasp of internal rhythm as did Bird, Diz, & Bud, that everybody else had to "simplify" the music in order to make it a viable community expression. That's not a value judgement or anything, just an observation. Interestingly enough, I've also gotten the same "nervous", etc. reaction to dance music styles like Drum 'N Bass & Broken Beat. Myself, I love that type of spreading the beat's legs apart and working it until all concerned are drained, sticky, and satisfied in both this type dance music & bebop. But it doesn't seem to have "mass appeal". Again, not a value judgement. I think that it's possible that for people who are more "wired" towards hearing/fealing a "beat" that, no matter how hard it swings, retains as its essence a forward-moving steadiness (as opposed to a forward moving breaking apart/coming back together) might not feel (literally) bebop to the extent they do Hard Bop, "greasy" Soul Jazz, etc. Yet again, not a value judgement. Make no mistake, Bebop as played by its originators is not a simple/predictable music. It's actually some of the most complex music of the 20th century (the rhythmic aspect in actuality, the harmonic aspect by implication). But only a handful of people had the capacities to play it that way, so it almost had to get "smoothed out" sooner than later. And if the music was that hard for the players, imagine how much harder it must be for the "general listener". In either Bird or, say, Sonny Stitt, you get the same basic vocabulary, but with Bird that vocabulary's going to be spoken in a significantly more variated (that's a Don Pullen word, btw) manner. So I can see how Stitt (or any number of other players) might be a more "comfortable" listen than Bird for many people. Again, and in conclusion, not a value judgement. But not an excuse either.

Except on the McLean Mosaic, iirc.

Lois Hi Dot & Ditto

Nor was mine, when I had it. I gave it to a friend when the CDs came out. MG Sorry. I meant "slick".

The first 3-4 WSQ sides on Black Saint are classics of the time imo. After that, things got less consistent, but never uninteresting.

Mean Mister Mustard Polyethelyne Pam The Plastic People

I'd like to hear it. I actually LOVE the Jackson 5. I think Michael was a force of nature when he was kid. Pity his brain eventually melted... Volume 1 (strongly recommended): http://www.dustygroove.com/item.php?id=534...p%3Bincl_cs%3D1 Volume 2 (less strongly recommended, but very enjoyable nevertheless): http://www.dustygroove.com/item.php?id=kk6...p%3Bincl_cs%3D1

Well, no, not exactly. I mean, not all were reissues of two complete LP's (nor was all of the material previously unreleased, but I know you didn't say that... just pointing it out). The Stanley Turrentine was not entirely comprised of previously unreleased material. The hard-to-get material I referred to (with Pearson arranging) was in fact previously unissued (and most has not been reissued since on LP or CD). The rest of the tracks on that twofer came from previously issued BN LP's ("Hustlin", "A Chip Off The Old Block", "The Look Of Love", and "Always Something There") and a few tracks were also issued on "New Time Shuffle". Similarly, I remember the Dexter Gordon twofer in the same series being a compilation of tracks from different sessions, most of which I believe had been released previously. Jim, you're talking about the very first series of the 2-fers, the "dotty" ones. That was just one set of releases. TTK's talking about the later "paper bag" series of 2-fers. There was a Turrnentine set in that series (although it had a glossy cover) - Jubilee Shouts, I believe it was called.

Yes. Back in the day I'd picked up a number of twofers in the tan with orange type series; and orange/brown with top green banner series. (For all I know, this may have been the same series with a packaging change). Anyway, a number of these twofers were comrpised of 2 unreleased albums. The McCoy Tyner and Stanley Turrentine sets come to mind. Being that each set had 2 albums, but one title, I'm assuming that, say, the McCoy Tyner albums weren't subsequently released on CD as "Cosmos Vo. 1" and "Cosmos Vol. 2." And I know there are a lot of Blue Note experts around here who could answer the question in much less time than it would take me to enter each TRACK title into Google (being that I couldn't guess the CD titles). Hence my original question... The McLean sessions have been noted above. I can get back with you on some of the others if somebody doesn't beat me to it.

Ok, let's push the envelope of geekdom... According to BSN : Look at this listing of the Blue Note LT-series, and look a the gaps in the numbering sequence, some of which we can fill in w/non-BN titles, some of which also had a non-LT prefix: * LT 987 Lee Morgan - Sonic Boom * LT 988 Wayne Shorter - The Soothsayer * LT 989 Dexter Gordon - Clubhouse * LT 990 Grant Green - Solid * LT 992 Jimmy Smith - Confirmation * LT 994 Jackie McLean - Consequence * LT 995 Hank Mobley - A Slice of the Top * LT 996 Bobby Hutcherson - Spiral LT-1000 - *Special Delivery - Dottie West [1980] LT-1001 - *Every Generation - Ronnie Laws [1980] LM-1002 - *Understanding - Bobby Womack [1980] LM-1003 - *This Diamond Ring - Gary Lewis and the Playboys [1980] LM-1004 - *Ricky - Ricky Nelson [1980] LM-1005 - *The Very Best of Slim Whitman - Slim Whitman [1980] LM-1006 - *It Must Be Him - Vikki Carr [1980] LM-1007 - LM-1008 - *Golden Greats - Bobby Vee [1980] LM-1009 - *Exotica I - Martin Denny [1980] LM-1010 - *Greatest Hits - Jay and the Americans [1980] LM-1011 - LM-1012 - LM-1013 - *Something Else - Shirley Bassey [1980] LM-1014 - LM-1015 - *Boogie with Canned Heat - Canned Heat [1980] Reissue of LST-7541. LM-1016 - *Midnight Cowboy - Ferrante and Teicher [1980] LM-1017 - *Out of Sight, Out of Mind - Little Anthony & the Imperials [1980] LT-1018 - *Standing Tall - Billie Jo Spears [1980] LT-1019 - *Gallagher - Gallagher [1980] LT-1020 - *Korona - Korona [1980] LT-1021 - *Saundra Steele - Saundra Steele [1980] LT-1022 - LT-1023 - *Ask Me To Dance - Cristy Lane [1980] LT-1024 - LT-1025 - *Dayton - Dayton [1980] LT-1026 - *Dream Come True - Earl Klugh [1980] LM-1027 - *Million Sellers - Fats Domino [1980] L?-1028 - L?-1029 - * LT 1030 Andrew Hill - Dance with Death * LT 1031 Lee Morgan - Taru * LT 1032 Grant Green - Nigeria Blue Note LWB-1033 - Silver & Strings Play Music of the Spheres - Horace Silver [1980] 2-LP set. NOTE - this is the last BN release of newly recorded material untin the label's "rebirth". LOO-1034 - *Favorites - Crystal Gayle [1980] LOO-1035 - *Gideon - Kenny Rogers [1980] LT-1036 - *Richard Leigh - Richard Leigh [1980] * LT-1037 - In Memory Of... - Stanley Turrentine L?-1038 - LOO-1039 - *Snakes and Ladders - Gerry Rafferty [1980] LOO-1040 - *The Black Stallion (Soundtrack) - Carmine Coppola [1980] LXB-1041 - *Fiddler on the Roof (Soundtrack) - John Williams [1980] 2-LP set; reissue of United Artists UAS-10900 LT-1042 - *Make a Little Magic - The Dirt Band [1980] LT-1043 - *Unity - Unity [1980] * LT 1044 Bobby Hutcherson - Patterns * LT 1045 Hank Mobley - Thinking of Home * LT-1046 - Live Sides - The Crusaders [1980] LT-1047 - *Positive Energy - Southroad Connection [1980] LT-1048 - *Going Deaf for a Living - Fischer-Z [1980] LT-1049 - *New Clear Day - The Vapors [1980] LT-1050 - *Calling - Noel Pointer [1980] * LT-1051 - Landslide - Dexter Gordon * LT 1052 Ike Quebec - With a Song in My Heart * LT-1053 - The Complete "Catch Me" Sessions - Joe Pass * LT 1054 Jimmy Smith - Cool Blues LT-1055 - * LT 1056 Wayne Shorter - Etcetera * LT 1057 Harold Land - Take Aim * LT 1058 Lee Morgan - Tom Cat LT-1059 - *Susie - Susie Allanson [1980] LT-1060 - *Brass Construction VI - Brass Construction [1980] LT-1061 - LT-1062 - Wild West - Dottie West [1980] LT-1063 - Eloise Laws - Eloise Laws [1980] * LT 1064 Art Pepper - Omega Alpha * LT 1065 Art Blakey - Once Upon a Groove LT-1066 - LM-1067 - The Slim Whitman Christmas Album - Slim Whitman [1980, abridged reissue] LM-1068 - Merry from Lena - Lena Horne [1980, abridged reissue] LM-1069 - LM-1070 - LM-1071 - Christmas with the Chipmunks - Chipmunks [1980] LOO-1072 - Greatest Hits - Kenny Rogers [1980] LOO-1073 - Heaven's Gate (Soundtrack) - Doug Kershaw [1980] LT-1074 - Only the Hits - Billie Jo Spears [1980] * LT-1075 - Mr. Natural - Stanley Turrentine [1980] * LT 1076 Leo Parker - Rollin' with Leo LT-1077 - T-1078 - Uncut - Powder Blues [1980] LT-1079 - Late Night Guitar - Earl Klugh [1980] LOO-1080 - A Woman's Heart - Crystal Gayle [1980] * LT 1081 Hank Mobley - Third Season LT-1082 - LT-1083 - I Have a Dream - Cristy Lane [1980?] LT-1084 - * LT 1085 Jackie McLean - Vertigo * LT 1086 Bobby Hutcherson - Medina LO-51087 - Solid Ground - Ronnie Laws [1981] * LT 1088 Art Blakey - Africaine * LT 1089 Ike Quebec - Congo Lament LT-1090 - Magnets - Vapors [1981] * LT 1091 Lee Morgan - Infinity * LT 1092 Jimmy Smith - On the Sunny Side LT-1093 - Cutie Pie - Dayton [1981] LT-1094 - All My Reasons - Noel Pointer [1981] * LT 1095 Stanley Turrentine - Ain't No Way * LT-1096 - Creeper - Donald Byrd LT-1097 - Sweet Thunder - Bill Medley [1981] LT-1098 - Fire and Ice - Bill Wray [1981] LT-1099 - * LT-1100 - As Time Goes By - Bill Evans & Bob Brookmeyer LT-1101 - * LT 1101 Gerry Mulligan - Freeway * LT 1102 Jean-Luc Ponty Live at Donte's * LT-1103 - Joy Spring - Joe Pass LT-1104 - Classix Nouveaux - Classix Nouveaux [1981] LT-1105 - Thirsty Ears - Powder Blues [1981] LW-1106 - Jealousy - Dirt Band [1981] LT-1107 - Distant Shores - Robbie Patton [1981] LOO-1108 - Share Your Love - Kenny Rogers [1981] LOO-1109 - For Your Eyes Only (Soundtrack) - Bill Conti [1981] LT-1110 - Mistral - Freddie Hubbard [1981] LT-1111 - Curves - Curves [1981] At this point the "Series numbering changes to 51000 series". Reissues continue (most of it from the PJ catalog, some y'all might remember that series), but no vault material is released. What we now need is to fill in the blanks for the latter 900 #s. BSN has no listings. BTW - we got some listings here for the BNs that BSN lists as blank. Also, if memory serves, the Ronnie Laws, etc. releases were by then on Liberty instead of BN. Apparently, the "New Note" wasn't getting hit any more... What all this serves to point out to me is just how stealth this whole series must have been. I mean, Andrew hill in the middle of Fats Domino & Crystal Gayle? C'mon....

Why is the Esso Oil Drop so sad? Just because it's gonna be cool? C'mon little fella, cheer up!

Alex, you might want to consider checking out those Soul Source J5 remixes (especially the first volume). Don't let the fact that it's The Jackson 5 (i.e. Motown bubblegum) dissuade you. Some of that stuff is more than a little radical in concept. Talk about hearing old things in new ways, the people who did this are all the way there. Plus it's musical in a big way.

The JMac session w/Moncur was on the Hipnosis two-fer & is currently available on the Moncur Select. The "High Freqency" session is the one from the Jacknife two-fer that's not seen release outside of the McLean Mosaic. So that's two from the two-fers that have not yet seen individual CD release.

That's a dash, dude, not a minus sign.

How about Untitled? The Stroker sounds kinda...kinky. As does Uncle Rough. How the hell can you mention those, and neglect to mention "Mr. Johnson"? Thought about it, but you know, too much of a good thing... For that matter "Claw-til-da" has always had a rather "visceral" sound to me. But I like fingernails, what can I say... So why don't we call it Lee Morgan - Sex? And include a remix of "The Rumproller" retitled "The Azz Tappa" just to seal the deal?

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php...ost&id=9165 Ok, what's that little State Fair Best of Show looking ribbon thing down in the lower right?

That could have been some really cool shit.

Uh... I think that TTK was asking about the Twofers, not the single disc LT series... Chuck's answer holds true for that as well.

I think I'm going to check this one out. I'd also like to hear objections to the concept that go beyond the facile "they're just doing it for the money" and/or "the originals are fine as they are" and/or "it's just pop music anyway, no sense in polishing a turd" etc. Well, yes. And no. Mostly, for me, the latter. I'm of an age, time, and place where I can honestly say that seeing The Beatles on the Sullivan show for the first time back in '64 changed my life, put me on a course that led me to being who I am today. I can also honestly say that it's not an uncommon phenomenon to have the past all sort of start to blur together as you get older. There's probably some psychological/neurological phenomenon that does that to keep us sane, just as we condense all our old belongings into scrapbooks, photo albums, etc. instead of us constantly buying bigger houses to hold it all (although there's a few freaks...). After a while, you just don't have room for it all, so you cull. I see the mashup element as a perfectly legitimate way of doing this. In fact, I see it as culling in a proactive, creative way. No way it's meant to "replace" the originals, but it does seem a good way to go about the business of clearing up/out some of the psychic space. Mash it all up, (re)mix it all together, turn three songs into one. Kinda like condensing files on your hard drive to open up more free space. Kinda. Anyway, I jsut wish that the Soul Source Jackson 5 remix projects would have gotten this much publicity, because although there's significantly less of the mashup thing going on there, there's also (probably) a helluva lot more "creative reinvention" going on. But that's hoping for too much, I know. All I can say is that until the Pop music for the new world crystalizes (well, it already has, thank you, Monday, but nobody's listening yet...), I'd rather hear creative de/re-construcuctions that pick our pockets by attempting to make something new (like a "perspective") out of something old than I would endless literal recyclings of old literalisms that attempt little more than to pick our pockets by trying to convince us that nothing's changing. Yeah, I think I'm going to check this one out.

That kinda reminds me of something I heard David Baker say once. He was telling how he used to preach to all his students that they had to master playing changes before they started playing free because you can't move on to the new before you fully understand the old. Well, one day he had a student who challenged him on that by asking him if he had mastered Kid Ory & Jack Teagarden before he got into JJ. Well, of course he hadn't. So Baker said that that was when he changed his stance to one of preaching that you merely should be respectably familiar with the past before going about the task of trying to invent the future. That's good advice for a player, no doubt. I mean, hey - if you spend all your time getting the old shit together, you'll never get into your own world, if only because the past consists of so many full and complete lives that trying to fit them all into one -yours - is neither cost/time efficient nor (meta)physically possible - it's like trying to put the Empire State Building into a Ziploc. Even with one of those bigass gallon ones, there's not enough room to put it all in... For people who don't play, it's probably not nearly as essential a dictum, In fact, I know it's not. But if we can all agree that curiosity can be fun, and that expansion of knowledge (like eating your vegetables ) won't kill you and might even lead to discovering a treat or two you'd not have discovered otherwise, then there's some validity to it. That's then more about a general mindset & life philosophy than it is any rigid musical dogma, and I think we'd all agree that having fun with an open mind is a helluva lot more preferable than "doing the right thing" out of a sense of guilt and/or fear.

Hey, I figured as much. We're cool.