ghost of miles

The re-recorded version of this program is now archived.

You know this is going to provide so much fodder for late-night-TV hosts.

Something more than what it would have otherwise. I don't know what that "otherwise" would be, though. All kinds of interesting things were happening under the commercial surface in the 1970s and into the 1980s, but the music was already moving--or was being moved by forces bigger than itself--to the margins. Lots of complext things going on, no easy answers (that I see, anyway), and to implicate jazz education as the culprit seems like a bit of a copout in and of itself. As for guys like Jackie & others abandoning said streets, were the streets still offering them the opportunity to make a living? How long does one have to keep running the streets, anyway? The streets are going to run away from them regardless. Why the need to play a blame game? I don't buy an archvillain in this narrative... I just don't. Institutions or personalities. To a large extent I think what's happened has been inevitable. And if kids are so enthusiastically drawn to jazz ed programs, what's so wrong with that? They're going to bring their own experiences, their own take on the world to their music. Believe me, there are kids out there doing interesting things... but they're doing them in basements or in record-stores or in whatever their town's equivalent of a loft-scene is. I talk to the kids playing in this town, and they have total love & respect for the older guys who've taught them. They're also far hipper to the "codification" and all that than perhaps we give them credit for. I completely agree that the best teachers have to stay open and be willing & able to learn back from their students. I wish the jazz audience were more open & willing... again there's this strong desire to hold onto a certain kind of "our jazz," coupled with a bemoaning of the artform's lack of growth & vitality, coupled once more with an outright rejection of anything that challenges our most cherished definitions of that artform. Blind alley blues. If there's a way out of the alley, it'll come from a bunch of artists and a much looser "movement" than what's come before... I'm not waiting for Bird Reincarnate to swoop down with the next Jazz Advance.

Oh, the academy is still there, but the curriculum has changed, and the faculty have (mostly) all ran away rather than deal with it on thier own, supposedly "higher" terms. Hip-hop is not the enemy of jazz. People who refuse to confront it on its own terms and steer it constructively, and who in the process leave it to its own worst impulses, are. Think about it - "back in the day", waaaaay back in the day, "jazz" was not a "respectable" music. But that didn't keep intelligent people, "street" and otherwise, from jumping in headfirst, and the music reaped immeasurable benefits from that combination of raw street vitality and a more "considered" intellectual input. Well, exactly--I think our thinking on this is pretty much alike, though your train of thought has traveled a longer track. I simply meant that the jazz academy of the streets is long gone. That's why I said >>The alternative is embracing a newer kind of "jazz" that won't fit many people's definitions of the word. That kind of jazz can & is being made outside of the classroom, though a fair # of the folks doing it have had some contact with the jazz education system.<< But IMO the streets were in the process of abandoning "jazz" before "jazz" abandoned them--or maybe it happened more simultaneously. The streets, based on my relatively limited experience of them (esp. compared to some other folk here), move without regard for the "sanctity" of art forms, though they will give past masters some respect... but primarily, they move to where the most rawly alive, vibrant & happening thing is going on. And it seems to me it's been several decades at least since they've found that in any element of jazz. Is that the fault of the jazz education system? I just don't think so, though the jazz education system, burgeoning as it is, may indeed be getting in the way of jazz's return to the streets... but I'm just about as inclined to think that the big bands will come back, too. Again, I think it comes down to what we define as "jazz." I've heard folks argue that hiphop, turntablism, rap, etc. is the new jazz (even though said forms are rather hoary themselves at this late point in the game). But it's all turning on definitions. I like to hear musicians who sound as if they've organically transcended the boundaries (rather than making self-consciously willed, contrived efforts to do so), who are speaking to a jazz heritage without being imprisoned by it. Thing is, I also enjoy a certain degree of jazz repertory too, whether it be hardbop, bebop, or son-of-Sixties improv. I guess my question is this--remove the jazz education efforts of the past 25 years, and what sort of role would jazz--as is generally defined on this board--be playing in our culture? It would still be there, to some extent, but I think it would be even less visible, prominent, influential, or whatever, then it is now.

"Gift," "Lazy Sunday" (the Narnia one) and the Natalie Portman gangsta rap all in this thread. They're the work of SNL player Andy Samberg and a couple of other guys from the Lonely Island site.

Having time to read & write is not exactly negligible though, in and of itself. I know a lot of writers/aspiring writers who'd all but kill for the simple quantity of relatively unfettered time. Whatever flaws may reside in mass creative education programs, we're talking about two art forms--jazz and literary fiction--that have been declining in mass-market popularity for decades. There's a fairly good jazz scene where I live, but take away IU, and nada... plenty of nothin'. Where are these kids going to learn their "trade" (however we may now define that) if not in jazz-education programs, either at the high-school or college level? The academy of the streets is long gone. Academia is a big, fat easy target to shoot at, and I'm not saying there aren't certain real/potentially stultifying aspects inherent in the system, etc. But jazz education, like it or not, has become, over the past two decades, the main lifeline for the music. Not to mention that many of the pros who've "made it" are doing so partly by leading workshops, clinics, playing university-subsidized gigs, and the like. The alternative is embracing a newer kind of "jazz" that won't fit many people's definitions of the word. That kind of jazz can & is being made outside of the classroom, though a fair # of the folks doing it have had some contact with the jazz education system.

Apocalypto Recut

Hey Danielle, to answer your original question, we have a great high-school music and jazz program here in Bloomington (Indiana)--Bloomington North's program, run by a woman named Janis Stockhouse. A very good pianist named Julian Bransby just graduated from there last year & is now studying with Luke Gillespie (great player himself--just heard him again last night) at Indiana University. The IU program, run by David Baker, is renowned and really makes the local jazz scene. So are you into Weather Report? A good friend of mine runs a record store here, and we've talked about how much interest 15-25-year-olds seem to have in that group. (Another thing--most of his customers over 30 buy CDs, and most of his customers under 30 buy vinyl.) In any event, very cool musical taste you have, and I hope you stick around! When I was in high school, I hated jazz, but my best friend loved it. He was a pianist and drummer who went to Berklee for a couple of years and now teaches on the East Coast... eventually he helped me get wise to how great this music is by turning me on to the old 2-LP set of Jazz at Massey Hall. If you like "Salt Peanuts," you should seek that one out (only one of many reasons why you should seek that out!).

A re-recorded version of this program, with the commentary tightened a bit and James Moody's "Last Train From Overbrook" added to the set-list, will air this evening at 11:05 p.m. EST on WFIU, at 9 p.m. Central Time on WNIN-Evansville, and at 10 p.m. EST Sunday evening on Michigan's Blue Lake Public Radio. The new version will be posted Monday afternoon in the Night Lights archives. Next week: "The Best Tenor You Never Heard: J.R. Monterose."

So I've heard--but are they still available? I have a couple of the GRP/Decca CDs that came out stateside.

No, but thanks for the heads-up--I'll seek it out. I wish that Lunceford Decca Mosaic had come to fruition...

Many happy returns, Nate, and many thanks as well. David

Elvis Costello does Strayhorn? Think I'll pass. Well, I'm going to stick my neck out & say I like what Costello does with the song. It's a trio performance--just Costello on vocals, Lovano on tenor sax, and Bill Charlap on piano--and to my ears he respects the spirit of it and adds something all his own... it actually ends up sounding almost like a Costello ballad, and I mean that in a good way. As Mr. Sangrey is wont to say, though, others' mileage may vary.

Good news about the Chu (though not for my achin' wallet).. I'm keen for that Mercer among the new projects.

Larry, completely agree with you about that D'Ambrosio cd--in fact, tapped a track off it for an Afterglow that's airing this week. Eager to hear the Gambarini (she has a new one w/Hank Jones coming out in Japan... not sure about a U.S. release).

Best to you, MJ.

Thank our lucky jazz stars for Hiroshi Tanno.

Thought I'd repost this from the Jazz Programmers List for any interested listeners: Link to WHRV here.

The hell with this desert island business--I'm taking my favorite artists to the Land of Chocolate!

Ghost of Crusoe says Bird, plus: Duke Miles Coltrane Billie On the weekend-country island: Tristano/Konitz/Marsh Herbie (Nichols) Jackie Mac Nat King Cole Elliott Smith

Mark Polizzotti says it's Charlie McCoy playing the second guitar in "Desolation Row." Is the earlier, electric take on the recent No Direction Home set?

Great quote from a 1962 Dylan interview in the 33 1/3 Highway 61 Revisited--and I post it as one who loves American popular song, Tin Pan Alley, etc.:

Ordered from them several times & the items always shipped quickly and arrived in great condition. Just got Rene Thomas' GUITAR GROOVE & Teddy Charles' EVOLUTION about a week ago, as a matter of fact.

Thanks for the rec, sir. We have a canon of New Year's Eve flicks from which we usually choose: Night at the Opera Casablanca Roman Holiday Some Like It Hot Charade Sabrina (Audrey Hepburn's a fave...can you tell? ) L.A. Confidential Monty Python & the Holy Grail This Is Spinal Tap