Unreleased Jackie McLean 1968 Blue Note session

[Rooster_Ties]

10 minutes ago, bresna said:

JM:  And it was great. It was fun.

Great googly-moogly!! 

[Dan Gould]

30 years after the fact he says it was great and fun yet he's never heard it. Note he didn't say "They didn't put that out?"

I'd trust his judgement in the moment that it was recorded that it didn't really congeal the way he wanted it.  I'd also trust Chuck's recollection of conversations that took place a lot closer to the recording date than this one.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Dan Gould

[felser]

1 hour ago, Dan Gould said:

30 years after the fact he says it was great and fun yet he's never heard it. Note he didn't say "They didn't put that out?"

I'd trust his judgement in the moment that it was recorded that it didn't really congeal the way he wanted it.  I'd also trust Chuck's recollection of conversations that took place a lot closer to the recording date than this one.

Don't disagree with any of that, but I'd still pay to hear it. 

[jazzbo]

I would too. It could be paired with the other Washington session in a 2 cd "Rejected Reissue" series premier release. 

[JSngry]

Jackie's Train Wreck Bag!

[felser]

And it could have appropriate series design of a black car Ala the rainbow and brown bag series designs.

[JSngry]

Train Wreck is better than we've been led to believe. but this other one, the Jackie session....the big "hmmmm…." factor for me there is Norman Connors...probably waaaaay over his head at that time and in that company. I would like to hear it, but would I pay for it as a standalone session?

hmmmm…

[Rooster_Ties]

I’d pay. It’s Tyrone Washington, of course I’d pay.

[felser]

They could finally put McLean s excellent 'High Frequency' session on a standalone CD and add the '68 session as bonus cuts.

And I wish there was a way for the rest of us to hear the Tyrone Train Wreck session!

Edited September 1, 2021 by felser

[Late]

35 minutes ago, felser said:

They could finally put McLean s excellent 'High Frequency' session on a standalone CD and add the '68 session as bonus cuts.

I'd buy that.

 

[bertrand]

Fascinating.

I read the article in which Jackie said Connors ruined the date. And now he says he never heard it.

And Cuscuna said Wayne said that his session was a disaster and blamed Duke Pearson. Yet, when I was trying to find out what the pieces on the session were for Michelle Mercer's book, Wayne told her that he had never heard it either.

Interesting parallel.

 

 

[JSngry]

Well, it's not their property, remember. It's their music but it's not their property.

[danasgoodstuff]

They should just do a series of all these supposed train wrecks and get it over with.  Put unflattering quotes on the covers, "A sea of avant-guard nothingness', etc..  Worked for Grand Funk and others...

[robertoart]

15 hours ago, danasgoodstuff said:

They should just do a series of all these supposed train wrecks and get it over with.  Put unflattering quotes on the covers, "A sea of avant-guard nothingness', etc..  Worked for Grand Funk and others...

[danasgoodstuff]

Just now, robertoart said:

Not a fan of Cosey et al with the Wolf, but yes that is an example of the kind of promotion I was talking about.  It feeds into a certain strain of American paranoid boneheaded resentment of experts that's ultimately rooted in something real but which can easily go seriously astray even before it gets going.

[felser]

23 hours ago, danasgoodstuff said:

Not a fan of Cosey et al with the Wolf, but yes that is an example of the kind of promotion I was talking about.  It feeds into a certain strain of American paranoid boneheaded resentment of experts that's ultimately rooted in something real but which can easily go seriously astray even before it gets going.

I actually like that one and the two similar ones by Muddy Waters, but I realize I am well in the minority, and have always been a sucker for 60s "psychedelic" stuff.

[danasgoodstuff]

4 hours ago, felser said:

I actually like that one and the two similar ones by Muddy Waters, but I realize I am well in the minority, and have always been a sucker for 60s "psychedelic" stuff.

My problem with those is not that the guys can't play, obviously they can and I like Cosey with Miles, but that they don't gel with Muddy or Wolf - it's totally oil and water IMHO, YMMV.  Might help if I didn't think of them as Muddy or Wolf albums but as albums by the young guys with Muddy and Wolf guesting.

Edited September 4, 2021 by danasgoodstuff
typo

[felser]

1 hour ago, danasgoodstuff said:

My problem with those is not that the guys can't plat, obviously they can and I like Cosey with Miles, but that they don't gel with Muddy or Wolf - it's totally oil and water IMHO, YMMV.  Might help if I didn't think of them as Muddy or Wolf albums but as albums by the young guys with Muddy and Wolf guesting.

Yeah, totally agree, they aren't Muddy and Wolf albums, they're Pete Cosey albums with guest vocals by Muddy and Wolf.  They don't hang together at all, but I find the clashing fascinating.

[danasgoodstuff]

1 minute ago, felser said:

Yeah, totally agree, they aren't Muddy and Wolf albums, they're Pete Cosey albums with guest vocals by Muddy and Wolf.  They don't hang together at all, but I find the clashing fascinating.

To get back to the subject at hand, it's hard to say whether anyone will find whatever 'problems'' there may be with this Jackie McLean date to be that kind of fascinating or not.

[Late]

Up for renewed reading. I'd forgotten about the Steve Lehman interview.

[bertrand]

Going back to my comment from 9/2/21.

Wayne also asked soneone who had the session if it was the session where Vitous bows a lot. He does. So Wayne did hear it?

Cuscuna said the Jackie tape was lost. Sounds like that happened years ago. There are some Blue Note reels at Rutgers, complicated story. Could it be there?

[Holy Ghost]

I think someone has a copy somewhere. So what if Norman Connors was "over his head" I'd pay to hear "Abrasion" at least once, gladly donate the royalties to Jackie's estate....

On 9/4/2021 at 3:34 PM, danasgoodstuff said:

To get back to the subject at hand, it's hard to say whether anyone will find whatever 'problems'' there may be with this Jackie McLean date to be that kind of fascinating or not.

In a way, wasn't Art Blakey's "Just Coolin'" in a similar bag, like iffy? But it was released (I bought it). Put out Abrasion, and I am going to believe everybody contributing to this thread would buy it. 

 

[Holy Ghost]

Guess, Abrasion will never see the light of day.

[Holy Ghost]

On 3/14/2007 at 9:26 PM, Chuck Nessa said:

"'cause it sucks" First, LMFAO!!!! Second you got to hear it???

 

 

'cause it sucks. As I understand only first takes were made 'cause JM was unhappy with the drummer and wanted the session over. Gotta respect the wishes of the leader.

 

[Holy Ghost]

On 3/14/2007 at 11:26 PM, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

i'd pay 15.99 to hear what a crappy jackie mclean session sounds like!

Me too.

On 3/14/2007 at 11:26 PM, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

i'd pay 15.99 to hear what a crappy jackie mclean session sounds like!

Me too.

On 3/14/2007 at 11:26 PM, chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez said:

 

Me too.

SL:  Yeah.

JM:  It was like I was improvising using them as an instrument like, you know. And it was great. It was fun.

And I have never heard that session.

SL:  Oh really?

JM:  Never heard it.

SL:  I hope it sees the light of day someday. Mr. McLean, this has been a real thrill.

 

This interview does not imply Jackie was opposed to this date being released; am I wrong???

Edited 1 hour ago by Holy Ghost
more goofiness i posted this once, not three times