Lists, and other sources

[Rabshakeh]

Other than word of mouth, social media and this board, I find that one of the best ways to discover new music is through lists that other music lovers post online.

Back in the day, Amazon's ListMania was an incredible resource for finding out about records. 

These days, I tend to rely quite heavily on lists appearing on (i) Discogs (which also feed into Discog's pretty good algorithmic recommendations) or (ii) the Rate Your Music website. (The latter's main functionality is as a rating for a group's records - basically useless - but the user generated lists are very strong.) There's a wide range of lists out there. Everything from some user's favourite hard bop on Blue Note, to incredibly detailed lists of mostly Yugoslavian jazz rock from the 1980s. It's a really good way to discover the "deep cuts".

Does anyone else use lists in this way?

Are there any other good sites that allow for user generated lists like these that I am missing?

[BillF]

I just look at what Peter Friedman's playing. 

[aparxa]

6 hours ago, BillF said:

I just look at what Peter Friedman's playing. 

I used to look at what BruceH was recommending 

As for jazz, the threads on the board such as 1 artist/1 record, List your favorite albums from xxx are helpful for a start, but elaborate comments in the  Artist Corner or  in threads such as What are you listening to (original thread and current) /What vinyl... are very informative.

As for non jazz, I much prefer RYM than Discogs (the rating system and the comments on Discogs are pretty much junk, even though I found some helpful World music lists  there).

As for classical music, I tend to read talkclassical.

As for movies, IMDB offers a lot of connaisseur lists, but I still miss the original Movie thread from the BigO board, a goldmine of information for a newcomer.

Overall, lists can be wonderful to discover new artists, but I find proactive searches/reads more rewarding. And recently, I tend to focus more on listening to my current jazz collection than systematically broadening my horizons, so much records I love and own that I spin so little. But that's another issue I guess 

[Bluesnik]

6 hours ago, aparxa said:

so much records I love and own that I spin too little. But that's another issue I guess

Same here!

[Rabshakeh]

I've just randomly found this: http://www.acclaimedmusic.net/forums/index.php a forum where users post lists of "Acclaimed Music". Bizarre idea. Something about it seems very early 00s.

[John L]

2 hours ago, Rabshakeh said:

I've just randomly found this: http://www.acclaimedmusic.net/forums/index.php a forum where users post lists of "Acclaimed Music". Bizarre idea. Something about it seems very early 00s.

I took a glance at their "greatest album of all time" lists - so incredibly white bread.   It is as if the great 20th century musical synthesis of African and European in the New World never happened, or that only the white manifestation of this synthesis has any value.  

Edited September 11, 2023 by John L

[clifford_thornton]

I used to use (and make) lists but can't keep track of 'em anymore... this board and its predecessors certainly have provided good recommendation lists, and Bandcamp is fairly good at that as well.

As much as I am loathe to admit it, social media does point me in certain directions sometimes, like if shop X is stocking a reissue I was unaware of. 

https://www.furious.com/perfect/staff2.html

[JSngry]

I have more than enough of my core beliefs, took care to do that before retirement. Now it's just a matter of paying attention now and then and carpe dieming if/when something I missed pops up, and/or something new comes out that I feel connected to.

[Rabshakeh]

1 hour ago, clifford_thornton said:

 

https://www.furious.com/perfect/staff2.html

This is good.

[HutchFan]

This thread reminds me of a thing happening on YouTube.  Someone started a trend where people create videos discussing the ten albums that they've played the most.  Not necessarily their favorites or their best or most important albums.  Just the records that get pulled from the shelf most frequently.  In other words, their musical comfort food.

Folks sometimes add constraints.  For example, some people add limits like "in the last five years" or they might focus on a single genre.

Some of the lists & videos are pretty interesting to look at.  And it's fun to think about.

 

I'm not interested in making a video, but I've given some thought to a list.  Limiting it to ten is the problem.

 

[JSngry]

Is a video the new blog? Or is that Tik-Tok?

I'm old. We used to just bring records over to each other's house and hang out all night. If you had a record that sucked and wasn't funny as a result, you left it at home. And if you didn't like something you said so. Maybe even argued about it, why not, say what you mean, and mean what you say. No hard feelings between friends! 

Do people not do stuff like that any more? 

[T.D.]

6 hours ago, Rabshakeh said:

This is good.

Yeah, I remember liking that one...back in the '90s I used to regularly visit the Perfect Sound Forever website.

[Big Beat Steve]

3 hours ago, JSngry said:

Is a video the new blog? Or is that Tik-Tok?

I'm old. We used to just bring records over to each other's house and hang out all night. If you had a record that sucked and wasn't funny as a result, you left it at home. And if you didn't like something you said so. Maybe even argued about it, why not, say what you mean, and mean what you say. No hard feelings between friends! 

Do people not do stuff like that any more? 

 

Quite true.

In general I shy away from "lists" thrown out in the wilderness at random, particularly since they all too often aren't just "recommendations" but have a "you must hear these otherwise you're nowhere" tone to it. Which is why I cannot take those "100 records you must hear before you die" books etc. too seriously. 

I rather prefer lists of recommendations compiled specifically as a reaction to clear-cut questions about recommendations for this or that artist and/or style. One such list that is on this forum is a lengthy list of recommendations for a "core record library" of Soul Jazz records compiled by our forum member The Magnificent Goldberg. Clearly a sensible, down-to-earth list compiled by someone extremely knowledgeable (BTW, where are you these days, MG? It would be nice to have you around again)

[gvopedz]

9 hours ago, JSngry said:

We used to just bring records over to each other's house and hang out all night. If you had a record that sucked and wasn't funny as a result, you left it at home. And if you didn't like something you said so. Maybe even argued about it, why not, say what you mean, and mean what you say. No hard feelings between friends! 

That sounds like what my friends and I did.  I also remember sitting in classes in high school and, while the teachers were explaining something, a friend and I would have a conversation that went something like this:

“I bought the band’s most recent album.”

“That’s not a good album.  You should’ve bought the band's previous album.”

“It IS a good album.”

“It is NOT a good album.”

[HutchFan]

12 hours ago, JSngry said:

Is a video the new blog? Or is that Tik-Tok?

I'm old. We used to just bring records over to each other's house and hang out all night. If you had a record that sucked and wasn't funny as a result, you left it at home. And if you didn't like something you said so. Maybe even argued about it, why not, say what you mean, and mean what you say. No hard feelings between friends! 

Do people not do stuff like that any more? 

I'm lucky.  I have a few friends and some family who are music lovers.  We discuss music, listen to records together (usually in my basement), and share new musical finds.  So, speaking for myself, that sort of thing still happens in my life.  But it doesn't happen nearly as much as I wish it could.

So I think that sharing via YT or other social media platforms is just an extension of the "in person" thing.  Like I said, I haven't posted any videos.  In fact, I don't even have any social media accounts.  But taking an occasional look at YouTube videos is an easy way to see & hear what other folks "out there" might be grooving to.   

Really, I think the whole social media thing is a variation on what we're doing here -- except (over time) on this forum we can learn one another's tastes and predilections. So some folks' recommendations here are much more helpful & meaningful -- because we know where the listener is coming from, musically speaking. 

That's one of the reasons why I love this place.  We're all just comparing notes about music.   It just happens to be happening in virtual space. 

 

[mjzee]

I remember a wonderful heated conversation in college between two friends as to who was better: Robert Johnson or Kiss.  It was so funny; I wish we had phones with video back then.  As you can imagine, after a while, it just devolved into personal name-calling.

[HutchFan]

9 hours ago, Big Beat Steve said:

In general I shy away from "lists" thrown out in the wilderness at random, particularly since they all too often aren't just "recommendations" but have a "you must hear these otherwise you're nowhere" tone to it. Which is why I cannot take those "100 records you must hear before you die" books etc. too seriously. 

Totally agree with you that the spirit of some (many?) list-makers is obnoxious and off-putting.  But not all of them!  (I hope.  Since I'm one of them. )

To me, it all comes down the attitude of the person making the list.  Remember "Show & Tell" from back in the day?  (I did it in kindergarten.)  You'd bring your favorite toy or comic book or whatever to school and then stand in front of the class and explain to everyone why you dig it?

The people who have that sort of spirit -- "Let me SHARE something with you that I really enjoy.  You might enjoy it too."  That's what I like best.

That sort of "Show & Tell" spirit happens here all the time, I think.  Given the contentiousness and stupidity of most social places on the internet, this forum is an oasis of sanity. 

 

Edited September 12, 2023 by HutchFan

[clifford_thornton]

13 hours ago, JSngry said:

I'm old. We used to just bring records over to each other's house and hang out all night. If you had a record that sucked and wasn't funny as a result, you left it at home. And if you didn't like something you said so. Maybe even argued about it, why not, say what you mean, and mean what you say. No hard feelings between friends! 

Do people not do stuff like that any more? 

nah, I think show and tell is through places like Instagram. Most of my music friends don't live in the town I live in, and I can't remember the last time I sat down and listened to a record with a fellow music nerd -- it's been years. 

[JSngry]

20 minutes ago, mjzee said:

I remember a wonderful heated conversation in college between two friends as to who was better: Robert Johnson or Kiss.  It was so funny; I wish we had phones with video back then.  As you can imagine, after a while, it just devolved into personal name-calling.

Bill & Ted vs. Wayne's World!!!! 

[T.D.]

I sometimes enjoy reading lists, but they can be also be irritating.

Not to troll or anything, but I recall Thurston Moore posting some list of free jazz favorites that got absolutely roasted on this forum (there's a thread somewhere in the archives, it was quite a while ago).

[Found it] 

 

I think the big problem with that one was the writing, which seemed somewhat pretentious and poseur-like. I can dig suggestions, but please spare me the self-parodic ramblings. 😉

Edited September 12, 2023 by T.D.

[HutchFan]

2 minutes ago, T.D. said:

I think the big problem with that one was the writing, which seemed somewhat pretentious and poseur-like. I can dig suggestions, but please spare me the self-parodic ramblings. 😉

T.D., I don't remember that particular post.  But I don't have a hard time imagining it. 

An I-know-it-all-better-than-you attitude wrecks the game, no matter who happens to be making the list.

 

[Rabshakeh]

12 minutes ago, T.D. said:

I sometimes enjoy reading lists, but they can be also be irritating.

Not to troll or anything, but I recall Thurston Moore posting some list of free jazz favorites that got absolutely roasted on this forum (there's a thread somewhere in the archives, it was quite a while ago).

[Found it] 

 

I think the big problem with that one was the writing, which seemed somewhat pretentious and poseur-like. I can dig suggestions, but please spare me the self-parodic ramblings. 😉

That was a really useful list from a time when this music was much more obscure than it is now. Shame about the hipster verbiage.

[T.D.]

2 minutes ago, HutchFan said:

T.D., I don't remember that particular post.  But I don't have a hard time imagining it. 

An I-know-it-all-better-than-you attitude wrecks the game, no matter who happens to be making the list.

 

I found the thread and edited my post.

In hindsight, TM's writing wasn't really all that bad, nor was the forum reaction all that negative.

But the "hipper than thou" style of some prominent list compilers does grate on me.

[clifford_thornton]

11 minutes ago, T.D. said:

I sometimes enjoy reading lists, but they can be also be irritating.

Not to troll or anything, but I recall Thurston Moore posting some list of free jazz favorites that got absolutely roasted on this forum (there's a thread somewhere in the archives, it was quite a while ago).

[Found it] 

 

I think the big problem with that one was the writing, which seemed somewhat pretentious and poseur-like. I can dig suggestions, but please spare me the self-parodic ramblings. 😉

I mean, it was the 90s -- and that comment thread is just as bad (yeesh on some of mine). But I will say that the whole article is pretty solid and stands up today. All of the records he mentioned are canon, whether or not his list helped that fact. 

Still ride hard for Doyle, no matter what Sangrey and Nessa say.

[T.D.]

11 minutes ago, clifford_thornton said:

I mean, it was the 90s -- and that comment thread is just as bad (yeesh on some of mine). But I will say that the whole article is pretty solid and stands up today. All of the records he mentioned are canon, whether or not his list helped that fact. 

Still ride hard for Doyle, no matter what Sangrey and Nessa say.

Yeah, I just re-read much of the thread. Agreed that the substance of the article was solid. I sometimes go overboard about matters of style. I've been trying to focus (and not just in music reading) on what's being said as opposed to how it's phrased, but being an old fart I don't always manage to.

No comments on Doyle, I haven't heard anything by him yet (combination of scarcity and a certain amount of negative reviews). I have no beef with the recordings on TM's list, in fact it's grown on me over time.