Soundtracks that are more famous than the film

[Rabshakeh]

What are some examples where a soundtrack to a commercial film is better or more well known than the film itself, or subsequently takes on a life of it's own?

Not counting films that are tied in to an album, like Buena Vista Social Club.

The Harder They Come has to be the leader. Surely only a fraction of the people who own that soundtrack have even thought of watching the film, although the film itself is sort of low fly good.

Superfly, with it's Curtis Mayfield soundtrack is another example. 

Black Orpheus and Lift to the Scaffold are two other examples, both more closely tied to the jazz world.

[Eric]

Ha ha.  Saw the title, immediately thought of “The Harder They Come”!

Edited August 10, 2023 by Eric

[Teasing the Korean]

The obvious answers will be pop stars' soundtracks to forgotten films.  Several blaxploitation films would fall into this category.  

If we expand to television, there are "soundtrack" albums that enjoyed a certain degree of popularity beyond the shows.  Peter Gunn remained in print well into the digital era.  Of course, that is not really a soundtrack album, but a conventional Mancini album packaged as a soundtrack to move units.

There are many, many film scores that are better than the films they supported, but the scores are not particularly well known.

And there are dozens if not hundreds of pop standards that originated in forgotten films.

Edited August 10, 2023 by Teasing the Korean

[mjazzg]

Coppola's 'One From The Heart' perhaps

Although the Waits/Gayle album is hardly household famous except in my household

Marvin's 'Troubleman'?

Quadrophenia

Tommy?

[Rabshakeh]

1 hour ago, Teasing the Korean said:

The obvious answers will be pop stars' soundtracks to forgotten films.  Several blaxploitation films would fall into this category.  

But other than Superfly, what are we talking?

[Teasing the Korean]

10 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said:

But other than Superfly, what are we talking?

Shaft and Trouble Man, for starters.  I would add that Willie Hutch's scores for The Mack and Foxy Brown have had a long shelf life, primarily because of DJ culture.  Ditto for Roy Ayers' score to Coffy. and the J.J. Johnson/Bobby Womack score to Across 110th Street.

I would argue that Mancini's score to Breakfast at Tiffany's has had more longevity than the film, which is dated and problematic, primarily because of the insensitive and offensive casting of George Peppard as the male lead.  Times were different then.

Edited August 10, 2023 by Teasing the Korean

[Rabshakeh]

1 hour ago, mjazzg said:

Coppola's 'One From The Heart' perhaps

Although the Waits/Gayle album is hardly household famous except in my household

Marvin's 'Troubleman'?

Quadrophenia

Tommy?

I think Quadrophenia and Tommy are probably music tie ins like Buena Vista social club. Was Tommy an album first or a film first?

[Teasing the Korean]

12 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said:

I think Quadrophenia and Tommy are probably music tie ins like Buena Vista social club. Was Tommy an album first or a film first?

Both of the Who titles were albums first, films later.

If we are using these as a barometer, we could include Sgt. Pepper. 🤣

[Big Beat Steve]

6 hours ago, Rabshakeh said:

Black Orpheus and Lift to the Scaffold are two other examples, both more closely tied to the jazz world.

I had spontaneously thought of "Ascenseur pour l'Echafaud" (Lift To The Scaffold) too but on second thought I wouldn't be so sure. I think our own impressions are severely biased by our jazz knowledge. French "Film Noir" is a genre to itself, and this movie is a key opus within that genre. I doubt that overall there are all that many cinéastes (particularly in continental Europe and its country of origin, in particular) who, when this film is evoked, think "Miles Davis" first and NOT "Louis Malle" or "Jeanne Moreau".
If you want to go down that route, I think that Art Blakey's Jazz Messengers' score to "Des Femmes Disparaissent" (literally: "Women Disappear") as part of the Jazz Messengers' discography is a more likely candidate. Particularly since that movie was considered more of a sensationalist "B movie" of doubtful eternal artistic merits at the time. Which is borne out by the "evocative" period titles of this movie in other languages:

English: The Road to Shame
German: Blonde Fracht und schwarze Teufel (Blonde Freight and Black Devils)
Italian: I Vampiri Del Sesso (The Vampires of Sex)
Spanish: Vampiros Del Amor (Vampires of Love)

Nuff said?

 

Next one up in that corner of the film world that I'd suggest to see if it is the movie or the score that is remembered best today: "Les Liaisons Dangereuses" (the film by Vadim, not that recent TV soap!). Less clear-cut than "Ascenseur Pour L'Echafaud" IMO but open to debate ...

Edited August 10, 2023 by Big Beat Steve

[Teasing the Korean]

52 minutes ago, Big Beat Steve said:

I had spontaneously thought of "Ascenseur pour l'Echafaud" (Lift To The Scaffold) too but on second thought I wouldn't be so sure. I think our own impressions are severely biased by our jazz knowledge.

I think that because popular culture has become so fragmented into different subcultures, questions such as that asked by the OP are likely to elicit very different responses, depending on whom you talk to.

[mjazzg]

1 hour ago, Rabshakeh said:

I think Quadrophenia and Tommy are probably music tie ins like Buena Vista social club. Was Tommy an album first or a film first?

Sorry, not paying sufficient attention 

[HutchFan]

I can think of plenty of film composers whose music has independence aside from the films they're associated with. (Not sure if this is the same as "more famous than.")

For example, Korngold's music often strikes me as more lasting and interesting than many of the swashbucklers he scored for.

Morricone's and Rota's music might not be "more famous" than the films they were used in, but -- these days -- plenty of folks come to their music independently, without having seen the films.

Even some of Bernard Herrmann's music fit the bill.  Those screeching, dissonant strings are inextricably part of the film Pscyho -- but how many people actually watch Beneath 12-Mile Reef these days?  I'm only aware of that movie because of BH's music, not the other way around.  And you could say the same about a lot of Herrmann's scores -- if you put aside the blockbusters like Psycho and Vertigo.

 

[Teasing the Korean]

25 minutes ago, HutchFan said:

I can think of plenty of film composers whose music has independence aside from the films they're associated with. (Not sure if this is the same as "more famous than.")

For example, Korngold's music often strikes me as more lasting and interesting than many of the swashbucklers he scored for.

Morricone's and Rota's music might not be "more famous" than the films they were used in, but -- these days -- plenty of folks come to their music independently, without having seen the films.

Even some of Bernard Herrmann's music fit the bill.  Those screeching, dissonant strings are inextricably part of the film Pscyho -- but how many people actually watch Beneath 12-Mile Reef these days?  I'm only aware of that movie because of BH's music, not the other way around.  And you could say the same about a lot of Herrmann's scores -- if you put aside the blockbusters like Psycho and Vertigo.

Yes, and I would say that Jerry Goldsmith may be the best example of an A-list composer, in every sense of the term, who scored more turkeys than classics.  The most enduring film he scored is probably Chinatown, followed by Seconds and Planet of the Apes.  But he provided amazing scores for some real dogs, such as The Swarm.

[Stonewall15]

The soundtrack for "Vanishing Point" is excellent. So is the movie!

[Teasing the Korean]

18 minutes ago, Stonewall15 said:

The soundtrack for "Vanishing Point" is excellent. So is the movie!

I LOVE that film!  I can't recall the music, though!

[felser]

And the movie actually was really interesting.

 

[Chuck Nessa]

[Rabshakeh]

1 hour ago, Chuck Nessa said:

Oh yeah! A great example.

7 hours ago, Big Beat Steve said:

the "evocative" period titles of this movie in other languages:

English: The Road to Shame
German: Blonde Fracht und schwarze Teufel (Blonde Freight and Black Devils)
Italian: I Vampiri Del Sesso (The Vampires of Sex)
Spanish: Vampiros Del Amor (Vampires of Love)

Nuff said?

Great stuff. Italy as always showing the sophistication and verve that gave us Giotto, Antonioni and Verdi.

[Teasing the Korean]

Tangentially related to this topic is common soundtrack albums for forgotten films, vs. rare soundtrack albums for celebrated films.

Using my beloved Kenyon Hopkins as an example, his soundtrack album for the forgotten Mr. Buddwing is very easy to find, while his soundtrack album for The Hustler, probably the most famous film he scored, is not.

[Rabshakeh]

Was that a distribution thing? It is easy-streamin'.

[Teasing the Korean]

9 minutes ago, Rabshakeh said:

Was that a distribution thing? It is easy-streamin'.

No idea, but there are many examples like that.  Why are there still so many sealed copies - with the 49 cents sticker intact - of Alex North's The Shoes of the Fisherman?   Maybe they were bad at predicting the success of films.

[Dmitry]

Jesus Christ Superstar

[clifford_thornton]

On 8/10/2023 at 5:12 PM, Chuck Nessa said:

Totally. Finally saw the film on Criterion and while my patience is strong for lesser-known French (late) new wave, this one didn't quite hold my attention...

I'd think Zabriskie Point would be another, as would Pink Floyd's More soundtrack.

The collection of Can soundtrack music (called Soundtracks) is also far more well-known than any of the experimental films that used the tunes.

[Teasing the Korean]

12 minutes ago, clifford_thornton said:

Totally. Finally saw the film on Criterion and while my patience is strong for lesser-known French (late) new wave, this one didn't quite hold my attention...

The album hasn't stayed in print continually enough to be very well-known.  The "Yo-Yo" track is well known because it was on some comps.  It is definitely the money cut.

[Rooster_Ties]

I can’t imagine very many people have even ever had the opportunity to see the film/documentary that Miles Davis wrote the soundtrack for — about heavyweight boxer Jack Johnson…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Johnson_(film)