Oscar Peterson - RIP

[Hot Ptah]

I don't disagree with you (Post 117). I respect Oscar Peterson's playing, and have liked some of it. He is somewhere in the middle for me if I had to rank all jazz pianists, favorite to least favorite. My tastes run more to the flavors which are acquired tastes. I like cappacino crunch ice cream more than vanilla. I can't say that vanilla is bad per se, though.

I think that he became a public figure somehow, and a civic figure in Canada, and public and civic figures get publicized when they die. It has little to do with the merits of what they achieved in their field. I don't think that the amount of column inches he received when he died has anything to do with what kind of pianist he was.

I don't understand the need to bash him to counteract the great praise he has received in the press. The press printing this stuff cares not at all. These canned biographies, including his, were no doubt prepared long ago by beginning staffers, and added to without much thought after the obituary database went online, whenever Oscar received awards, honors, Canadian government accolades, etc.

I think that if he had been born in the equally cold Upper Peninsula of Michigan, instead of in Canada, his press clippings would be about the same as those received by Stan Getz when Getz died. The Canadian honors added a lot to what could be easily researched and reported on when he died.

I guess my overall thought is, when Jaki Byard died it should have been on the front page of every newspaper in the country. Press coverage has nothing to do with the musical merits of the individual. So why lash out if someone lucks into good coverage, when it is all irrational?

I am not referring to obituaries written by someone of the caliber of Larry Kart in this discussion. Many of the articles I have read since Oscar Peterson died strike me as hack work put together by people who knew nothing about him.

Edited December 27, 2007 by Hot Ptah

[JSngry]

Press coverage has nothing to do with the musical merits of the individual. So why lash out if someone lucks into good coverage, when it is all irrational?

Well, if it really is "irrational", why is it "rational" to quietly accept it & appear to offer implicit concurrance?

[JSngry]

I recall one case where it became almost comically explicit, though the writer of this obit was my predecessor in writing about jazz for the Chicago Tribune, Harriet Choice. The musician who had died was Cannonball Adderley, and the editor involved asked Harriet, as though it were a foregone conclusion given her request for space on page one, "He was the greatest living jazz musician, right?" Harriet coolly said, "No -- he wasn't." What struck me as funny there was that Harriet not only was not a person to be pushed around, but she also thought that she should have been running the whole damn paper -- and she might well have done a good job of it, too.

I've never heard of Harriet Choice, but now feel as if I need to. Please tell more, maybe in the Jazz In Print forum. Sounds like there might be some stories there!

[Hot Ptah]

Press coverage has nothing to do with the musical merits of the individual. So why lash out if someone lucks into good coverage, when it is all irrational?

Well, if it really is "irrational", why is it "rational" to quietly accept it & appear to offer implicit concurrance?

One could comment, "wow is this weird! Look at the far too long article in this totally unaware rag that passes for a newspaper in this town!", instead of "I never liked the guy".

[JSngry]

Press coverage has nothing to do with the musical merits of the individual. So why lash out if someone lucks into good coverage, when it is all irrational?

Well, if it really is "irrational", why is it "rational" to quietly accept it & appear to offer implicit concurrance?

One could comment, "wow is this weird! Look at the far too long article in this totally unaware rag that passes for a newspaper in this town!", instead of "I never liked the guy".

Yeah, but then one appears to be making a blanket attack on the media as a whole instead of attempting to add another perspective, hopefully a reasoned and considered one, to a specific Discussion In Progress. Blanket attacks are easily/thoughtlessly concurred with or dismissed, engaging on specifics less so. If you can find anybody who cares...

And do you really think that "I never liked the guy" (and a hopefully reasoned and considered delineation of why not) equates with "bashing"? That's a serious question, because I myself don't remotely see it like that.

I really see no impropriety in expressing an opposing viewpoint at any point in An Ongoing Event Of Media Orthodoxy. Failure to do so is one way how future generations lose grasp of the nuances of any given time. And there are forces at work (although I doubt that any of them are at work with this Oscar Peterson business) who attempt to control/limit/stifle any/all dialogue for precisely that reason.

[Larry Kart]

I've never heard of Harriet Choice, but now feel as if I need to. Please tell more, maybe in the Jazz In Print forum. Sounds like there might be some stories there!

I could tell you more, but then, as they say, I'd have to kill you. Actually, you'd have to write a good and good-sized novel to attempt to capture Harriet. She was smart, could be quite imperious, had terrific instincts as an editor (was at once very down to earth and very romantic about the newspaper business), liked to try to run other people's lives and had some success at doing that, loved traditional jazz first (though her tastes were broad) and got along well with musicians of that generation or two (or three) in particular. She left the Tribune after she told higher-ups one too many times that she knew how to do their jobs better than they did; she then went to work for Universal Features (handling travel writers, comic strip artists, etc.). Haven't heard from or about her in a while, but I'm sure she's still motoring along at a good clip. She'd be about my age -- 65. I see a mention for her on the 'Net under "Harriet Choice Communications." That sounds about right.

[jlhoots]

I didn't look at this thread until now (& didn't look at all of it).

I'm not surprised by the naysayers - but some of this "bashing" (don't know what else to call it) seems inappropriate.

Live At The Stratford Shakespearean Festival always did (& still does) do it for me.

[danasgoodstuff]

Did anyone notice that the Ellington quote quoted above (post #77) is quite surreal, ""Mrs. Clinkscales"?, and when Duke was "a small boy" Peterson hadn't been born yet, much less gotten famous so it's unlikely dukes piano teacher was telling him anything about Oscar...

Edited December 28, 2007 by danasgoodstuff

[Larry Kart]

Did anyone notice that the Ellington quote quoted above (post #77) is quite surreal, ""Mrs. Clinkscales"?, and when Duke was "a small boy" Peterson hadn't been born yet, much less gotten famous so it's unlikely dukes piano teacher was telling him anything about Oscar...

Ellington's childhood piano teacher was, indeed, Mrs. Marietta Clinkscales. See "The Duke Ellington Reader," p. 6. The line about "don't sit down at the piano after..." is just Ellington recycling an old joke, a la the one about the New York concert debut of some new piano virtuoso, say the young Horowitz. Rachmaninoff and Fritz Kreisler are seated in the front row, and after Horowitz rattles off a piece or two, Rachmaninoff says, "Is it getting hot in here?" To which Kreisler replies, "Not for violinists."

[medjuck]

Did anyone notice that the Ellington quote quoted above (post #77) is quite surreal, ""Mrs. Clinkscales"?, and when Duke was "a small boy" Peterson hadn't been born yet, much less gotten famous so it's unlikely dukes piano teacher was telling him anything about Oscar...

Ellington's childhood piano teacher was, indeed, Mrs. Marietta Clinkscales. See "The Duke Ellington Reader," p. 6. The line about "don't sit down at the piano after..." is just Ellington recycling an old joke, a la the one about the New York concert debut of some new piano virtuoso, say the young Horowitz. Rachmaninoff and Fritz Kreisler are seated in the front row, and after Horowitz rattles off a piece or two, Rachmaninoff says, "Is it getting hot in here?" To which Kreisler replies, "Not for violinists."

Accoding to Steve Voce it's something Duke often said when he was following on stage a piano player he admired. Voce mentions Nat Pierce as an example but I'd like to imagine Ellington saying it about Willie the Lion or James P Johnson -- of course in those cases it could be a true story.

[Swinger]

Oscar Peterson was never my among my favorite pianists but I have a soft spot for album Night Train.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Well, jazz is showbiz and Oscar Peterson was every bit as good at that, in his way, as Willis Jackson was in HIS way. I like the IDEA of OP rather better than I like listening to his music.

MG

[AndrewHill]

For those interested there is an Oscar Peterson special on BET Jazz right now. I just happend to catch the middle of the show and I'm not sure when its on again. It looks like an hour long show called Rendezvous in New York. It ends at 11am. Enjoy!

[John Tapscott]

Personally, my least favorite recordings by Oscar are when he is playing solo piano. (Though the few recordings where he sings also were not to my taste.) It was when playing solo that his technique struck me as overwhelming the musical content. When playing in a trio setting, or as a sideman, Peterson sounded more relaxed and swinging.

I have received much pleasure from listening to Oscar over the years. His playing (for me) has an optimistic joyful quality. It is very different from the enjoyment I get from the more introspective impressionistic playing of Bill Evans, or the hard core bebop style of Barry Harris. Jazz and the listeners are the beneficiary of that wonderful diversity.

I was the second person to post the news of Oscar's death (after Robert J). It's interesting that both Robert J and I live quite geographically close to Oscar's home. About 10 minutes from my home in Mississauga, a new public elementary school opened last year bearing Oscar's name. I think Oscar appreciated the honor. Anyway, I posted the news without any comment because I knew just how controversial Oscar is among Board members. I figured some kind of musical row would erupt and I didn't want to be part of that. But I will say that Peter's comments above summarize precisely my thoughts and feelings about Oscar the pianist.

[AllenLowe]

but all seriousness aside, I think we have been respectful but dissident - nothing wrong with that, I think - there's an old phrase that has been used when examining the life of someone, "without tears," meaning giving that life a serious evaluation without obscuring sentiment - I would certainly hope that if I go under, everyone here will join in and recount what a saint I was - even those who have no idea who the hell I am -

Edited December 28, 2007 by AllenLowe

[ValerieB]

but all seriousness aside, I think we have been respectful but dissident - nothing wrong with that, I think - there's an old phrase that has been used when examining the life of someone, "without tears," meaning giving that life a serious evaluation without obscuring sentiment - I would certainly hope that if I go under, everyone here will join in and recount what a saint I was - even those who have no idea who the hell I am -

i believe you're still missing the point: nobody is saying that it's not perfectly ok to be "dissident" or to just state that you didn't appreciate OP, etc. i think it's common sense, however, that a RIP thread might not be the best place for those kinds of comment. i've noticed that another more appropriate thread has now been started. just wish it had been done sooner and that some of these posts could be transferred to it.

[clifford_thornton]

Here's a point that may or may not have already been made:

OP's death has obviously brought out a lot of people to weigh in on their feelings about his music, which might not have occurred to the same degree were he still alive (even on this board).

[rockefeller center]

Here's a point that may or may not have already been made:

OP's death has obviously brought out a lot of people to weigh in on their feelings about his music, which might not have occurred to the same degree were he still alive (even on this board).

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=12745

http://www.organissimo.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=9063

[Durium]

OSCAR PETERSON

But few people know that he was an excellent boogie woogie piano player too. And he could sing .....

Oscar's Boogie

Keep swinging

Durium

[Soul Stream]

I really dig Louis Armstrong & The Oscar Peterson Trio....and also Night Train. Wish I could have heard O.P. in person... looks like I'm condemned to a lifetime of McCoy/Herbie/Chick clones too hip to swing. RIP O.P.

Edited January 9, 2008 by Soul Stream

[BillF]

OSCAR PETERSON

But few people know that he was an excellent boogie woogie piano player too. And he could sing .....

Oscar's Boogie

Keep swinging

Durium

Oscar an excellent boogie woogie player? Now, if you were talking Meade Lux Lewis, Albert Ammons or Pete Johnson ...

Edited January 9, 2008 by BillF

[Durium]

OSCAR PETERSON

But few people know that he was an excellent boogie woogie piano player too. And he could sing .....

Oscar's Boogie

Keep swinging

Durium

Oscar an excellent boogie woogie player? Now, if you were talking Meade Lux Lewis, Albert Ammons or Pete Johnson ...

You're right, .......... these men were the originators, but I think Oscar Peterson had some more technically bagage !!

Keep swinging

Durium

[DMP]

I've always thought Peterson's solo on Charlie Parker's Verve "Night and Day" was the strongest of any by a sideman on Bird's studio recordings.

[LarryCurleyMoe]

Sad news; R.I.P. Oscar.

I was lucky enough to catch solo OP at the Kool Jazz Festival many years a go at Blossom Music Center in Ohio.

A friend couldn't go and sold me his ticket. He wasn't sure where the seat was.

Turned out to be FRONT ROW!

[garthsj]

I though that some of you might be interested in this report from the Toronto Star:

Musical Stars Come Out to Sing Oscar's Praises

by Martin Knelman

Toronto Star, January 13, 2008

Oscar Peterson was recognized all over the world as one of the giants of jazz, but from time to time he let it be known that he felt somewhat neglected at home, possibly even taken for granted.

Yesterday, that stigma was gloriously removed once and for all with a classy, highly emotional, star-studded tribute at Roy Thomson Hall to the swinging genius of the keyboard who died on Dec. 23 at age 82.

Admission was free but the opportunity to attend this event (organized by the National Arts Centre's ceo, Peter Herrndorf) seemed priceless to 2500 people who packed the hall for what had the mark of an unforgettable historic occasion. Contributing to the magic was the feeling that virtually everyone who appeared on stage for two and a half hours had a strong personal connection with Peterson.

As Valerie Pringle, the perfect host, reminded us, Peterson will be forever known as the man who redefined swing, mastering the balance between technique and tenderness.

The tone for the day was set by Governor General Michaëlle Jean, for whom this clearly represented more than just another ceremonial duty. She told about living in the same working-class neighbourhood of Montreal where Peterson grew up and about the hopes of immigrant parents from the Caribbean whose aspiration for their children was they could grow up to be, like Oscar, simply the best.

Veteran producer Brian Robertson achieved pacing and momentum by mingling spoken tributes by special guests with short and effective musical interludes featuring a star-studded lineup.

The Oscar Peterson Quartet assembled for this occasion included jazz musicians from Sweden, the U.S. and Canada. Monty Alexander, the pianist in the band, put us in an upbeat mood by almost out-Oscaring Oscar. But the pianist who brought the crowd to its feet was Herbie Hancock, who decided only a few days ago that he just had to be at this event and took a red-eye flight to overcome the obstacle of an impossible schedule.

Hancock recalled that when he was a teenager planning to become an electrical engineer, hearing a Jazz at the Philharmonic record changed his life. "Who is that piano player?" he asked. The answer, of course, was Oscar Peterson. If it hadn't been for that, Hancock confided, the world would have had one more electrical engineer.

Quincy Jones, the great jazz composer and conductor, drew a standing ovation as soon as he walked onto the stage. Recalling a half-century of collaborating with Peterson, Jones noted that jazz was never a macho form. "Musicians don't think twice about letting our feminine side come out."

Alluding to a memorable concert tour that featured Count Basie and Frank Sinatra, with Peterson and bassist Ray Brown as the opening act, Jones quipped: "I wouldn't dare repeat the dialogue I heard between Oscar and Ray."

Several speakers referred to Peterson's courage in continuing to perform after suffering permanent damage in a 1993 stroke. But in the words of Bob Rae -- accomplished pianist, former Ontario premier and friend of the Peterson family -- the world discovered that a one-handed Peterson was better than almost anyone else with two hands.

To my ears the musical highpoint -- and the emotional one as well -- was provided by the sublime Nancy Wilson, who quietly and plaintively sang a little-known song about the pain of saying goodbye, filled with expressive pauses. And she added: "In my heart, no one I have ever loved has left. They're always here."

The program included four female vocalists, but there was one glaring omission. Molly Johnson, Toronto's own marvellous jazz singer, was seated in the guest section but was left out of the performing lineup.

The proceedings came to an epic close as the stunning Measha Brueggergosman joined forces with the Nathaniel Dett Chorale, the University of Toronto Gospel Choir and the Sharon Riley and Faith Chorale for the finale: "To Freedom," a kind of inspirational anthem written by Peterson in 1962 in the era of anti-racism marches.

It got a rousing standing ovation from the audience. But to me, that is not the legacy of Oscar Peterson that will be joyously remembered decades from now.

It's the swinging Oscar I will always cherish -- the one who could create mood-elevating miracles with Harold Arlen tunes like "As Long as I Live," "It's Only a Paper Moon" or "Ac-cent-tchu-ate the Positive."

That's his true exit music. It doesn't get any better than that.

Edited January 14, 2008 by garthsj