BN Packaging i NEVER KNEW EXISTED!!!!!

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Herbie-Hancock-on-Blue-Note_W0QQitemZ300403750259QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMusic_on_Vinyl?hash=item45f1757573

look, he says in his description,

""""the sticker promoting Watermelon Man on the front serves to inform the purchaser that a 45 with an edited version of the song has been included with the LP."""""

well then look at the pics!!!!!!!!!! look, the 45, and look at the stamp on it!

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so we also then know they did this w/ NATURAL SOUL cause it has a similar "contains the hit single"...sticker....

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omg did u guys know about this? i always thought the sticker was simply refering the the album track!!!!!!

[Dan Gould]

Congratulations, Aric, you've taught me something I had not known about BN. The ironic thing is that this would have to be a later pressing and as such, the collector's mind would tend to discount its value; I think its kinda cool.

[brownie]

Not so sure it is a late pressing.

I have exactly the same LP (with the Watermelon Man sticker). It came directly from the BN offices shortly after its release.

The LP is still with the BN innersleeve of the time (the ones with the stamp-size albums covers on both sides), not the brown sleeve shown on the ebay post.

But there was no 45 with my copy

[Shrdlu]

Nice find! Thanks for posting.

[clifford_thornton]

Yeah, I thought it just referred to the album track too. Curious!

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I tend to side with Brownie on this, but I don't know when "Takin' off" was released. As far as I know, Herbie's single wasn't a hit. Mango Santamania's version was making noise early in 1963 and entered the R&B singles chart at the end of March. I don't think he would have had to have waited for Herbie's LP to come out before he recorded it - surely Herbie was working gigs and playing the song all through 1962.

MG

[JSngry]

The possibility that the eBay seller is combining discrete items to "present" something that never really existed must be considered here...

[colinmce]

I tend to side with Brownie on this, but I don't know when "Takin' off" was released. As far as I know, Herbie's single wasn't a hit. Mango Santamania's version was making noise early in 1963 and entered the R&B singles chart at the end of March. I don't think he would have had to have waited for Herbie's LP to come out before he recorded it - surely Herbie was working gigs and playing the song all through 1962.

MG

As it so happens, I just read the booklet for the Takin' Off RVG the other day. Herbie had been working on the song during 1962 and actually played it in an unfinished form while working with Santamaria in that year. Alfred Lion heard the performance and was floored by the tune and encouraged Herbie to finish it, which he did. Obviously, it was the cornerstone of the debut, which was recorded May 28, 1962. Mongo's version was recorded later that year.

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

I tend to side with Brownie on this, but I don't know when "Takin' off" was released. As far as I know, Herbie's single wasn't a hit. Mango Santamania's version was making noise early in 1963 and entered the R&B singles chart at the end of March. I don't think he would have had to have waited for Herbie's LP to come out before he recorded it - surely Herbie was working gigs and playing the song all through 1962.

MG

As it so happens, I just read the booklet for the Takin' Off RVG the other day. Herbie had been working on the song during 1962 and actually played it in an unfinished form while working with Santamaria in that year. Alfred Lion heard the performance and was floored by the tune and encouraged Herbie to finish it, which he did. Obviously, it was the cornerstone of the debut, which was recorded May 28, 1962. Mongo's version was recorded later that year.

I never knew he was working on it with Mongo - very interesting. Does lend support to my idea that Mongo didn't need to have waited for the album to be issued in order to know the tune.

"Hey, Mongo, my record's coming out soon; the one with that "Watermelon man" song on it."

"Good, I've got a session coming up..."

So, in the end, Blue Note could have issued "Takin' off" with those stickers and a 45 offer as a brand new release. It doesn't necessarily follow that what that seller has got isn't an original first pressing.

MG

[Chuck Nessa]

In the US, the owner of the copyright has choice of first issue. After that, all comers can get a license.

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

i got a reply from the seller, he said he asked the very famous musican who is selling it whos name he asked them not to use, said thats how he got it from bluenote...........

brownie....how did U get your copies right from the bluenote offices? did you visit them when u were in NYC?

[Chas]

The possibility that the eBay seller is combining discrete items to "present" something that never really existed must be considered here...

That was my thought , that is until I saw that the seller is Fred Cohen...

[brownie]

brownie....how did U get your copies right from the bluenote offices? did you visit them when u were in NYC?

After I started writing articles in French magazines in the late '50s, I needed to get BN albums which were pretty hard to get in Paris in those days and very expensive. BN accepted to ship me review copies for $2,50 a LP. Still pretty expensive back then. Most of my pocket money (I was still in highschool) went to purchase those Blue Notes.

Later when I traveled to New York in the mid-60s, I visited the BN offices (on 61st Street) and got more albums from Wolff and Lion!

They were pretty busy and did not have much time to talk to them. Beside on one of the visits, Roy Haynes was making some noise because he wanted a free copy of Silver's Song for my Father.

[mikeweil]

Is the 45 version an edit or an alternate short take? Or a two-part affair with fades?

[chewy-chew-chew-bean-benitez]

That is a very interesting story, roy haynes isnt even on blue note records, lol. he was just all im roy haynes gimme a song for my father--??

what was the offices really like? ??? were they messy. were there people everywhere or was it just the two of them (al fred and frank) and thats it?

i shoiuld of annotated this post, now that i think about it, but i just pasted a thread in this same ARTISTS category, about an ebay auction now for this 1957 JAZZ HOT issue, w/ a piece on Mobley, called "King of the Tenor Sax"---- do you know of this??????? i think its JJ johnson on the cover.........

[sidewinder]

or was it just the two of them (al fred and frank) and thats it?

+ Ruth Lion, presumably?

[brownie]

or was it just the two of them (al fred and frank) and thats it?

+ Ruth Lion, presumably?

No women when I dropped by.

The BN office was pretty bright with large windows. From what i remember there were just two or three people inside. The work place was separated from the visitors' space by a wooden barrier.

Should have taken photos when I visited the place

[Dan Gould]

Is the 45 version an edit or an alternate short take? Or a two-part affair with fades?

Weren't almost all of the 45s edits, except for releases like the vocal version of Senor Blues that was included on the CD?

[The Magnificent Goldberg]

Is the 45 version an edit or an alternate short take? Or a two-part affair with fades?

Weren't almost all of the 45s edits, except for releases like the vocal version of Senor Blues that was included on the CD?

No - my copy of "Back at the chicken shack" is a two-sided affair and the same as the LP version - only with LOTS of scratches and surface noise, because it was on a juke box in Alabama for seven/eight years before I had it

MG

[mikeweil]

That is a very interesting story, roy haynes isnt even on blue note records, lol.  

Roy Haynes was on the Art Blakey drum ensemble session that was released only in the Connoisseur series as "Drums Around the Corner", and, more importantly, he was on Andrew Hill's "Black Fire"!

[colinmce]

Don't forget Hill's Smokestack, one of Roy's finest showings ever, imo.

[JSngry]

[Chuck Nessa]

Hagnes recorded for BN with Bud - '49, Blakey - '58, Jackie - '63, Andrew - ' 63 (twice), Jackie - '64.

If you don't get "Hagnes" contact me.

[Rooster_Ties]

uploading image, for when the eBay listing goes dead...

Edit: Couldn't upload the the pic of the album cover (with the sticker), too big -- can somebody resize, and upload to this thread?? (Did get the single, though.)

[Chas]

For the record , this copy sold for $536...