Big Beat Steve

Two, in fact: "Claude Williamson" (BLP-59) and "Round Midnight" (BLP-69).

The first 8 sides (complete with alternates) from the above Classics CD can be found on this LP (TAX m-8015, Sweden):

Please don't get totally carried away, everybody ... That's not worth it ...

Indeed, and that's EXCEEDINGLY common.

Thank goodness neither Leonard Feather nor John Hammond have ever had a chance of becoming members of this forum, then. Now THAT would have raised sumpin'!

You don't. I have 28. And I also own some 45 LPs covering mostly the 1950-1958 period as well a 2-CD set with his 50s Capitol TRANSCRPITIONS. So I guess I qualify as a sort of fan. In fact at a local clearout sale yesterday i bought his "Some Women I've Known" LP from his own Creative World label and found it rather refreshing to listen to (though I am not the biggest fan of female 50s jazz vocalists in the world). count me in among those who find more in his music from that period tha tother who constantly denigrate him - though, OTOH, after having bought and listened to his somewhat legendary "The Kenton Era" 4-LP set I can understand (to a degree) those who take him to task for his "bombastic excesses" and there are moments when I can understand Shelly Manne who found the job in his band like "chopping wood" too. But there is plenty of Kentonia to discover to offset all that. And as for what Stereojack said about his "later" stuff (after the 40s and 50s) getting less interesting, one record I found quite fascinating is his "The Uncollected" Hindsight LP featuring transcriptions of his 1962 "Mellophonium" orchestra. Quite interesting, not bombastic at all to my ears, and really ear-catching. I am not familiar with his commercially released output with that band but what I heard there is really an intirguing starting point IMHO.

I hear you! :rofl: Though you know quite well the point was a different one. (Different people being accused of shortcomings at different times - and some of them in comparable ways - but definitely NOT ALL of these people being lumped together at the SAME time )

Thanks Jeff, but would you mind if I myself would opt for some SCOTCH instead? (Yes, that might be another case of disagreement Going to play me some Dodo Marmarosa now for some interesting harmonics.

Well, I guess we'd both agree on a lot of what we listen to on 78s, isn't it? (At least I'd agree with most of your comments on the 78s you reported on here ) And where we don't (on 78s or otherwise), wouldn't it be dreary if everybody had the same tastes? The bottom line IMHO is that anyway you look at it, a lot of what one would consider of merit really is in the "ear of the behearer". Because like MMilovan said, if you'd dissect the music really closely no doubt there would be tons and tons of aimless rambling "that goes nowhere" to be found in many of those "blowing sessions" dear to the heart of many hard boppers too.

Oh, well, the same can easily be said during listening to some very famous, well-known, "serious" jazz legends. And contemporary musicians too. Oh but you forget, MMilovan: George Shearing may (and will) probably be faulted for NOT making full use of what he is capable of. WHEREAS - those others who you probably think of (and me too ) played jazz in a style that might best be described as "anything goes". But if you feel that what they play just goes nowhere then either you just don't understand - or this rising and falling, going around in circles is an aim in itself because it is OH so intensely delivered ... ;) And then again there are those who actually were poor, tormented, pained souls who just could not cope with what they would have to cope in order to do things properly and not get hung up in what they did. So losing your way, rambling aimlessly on and fumbling in search of what you actually would have wanted to say is all fine by these standards, regardless of the fact that it ought to have remained mercifully unrecorded. Note: No, I am not primarily thinking about certain pianists that would come to mind but a case in point is ERNIE HENRY. Period reviews found his tone poor and uncultured, his playing childish, incapable of expressing his ideas, playing out of tune, straining at getting to grips with his instrument and at trying to say what he would have had to say, etc. And then all of a sudden in more recent reviews and writeups he is lauded for his oh so passionate and deeply felt playing. Now which is which, really? (My personal opinion based on what I've heard is probably somewhere between these two extremes) And to top it off, Bob Rusch states in one review his glaring errors and being out of focus would have been perfect if his name had been Ornette Coleman but not in his case since he just was not Ornette. Numb fumbling on purpose as something to strive for? Or doesn't it really only boil down to a case of what one would WANT TO HEAR in a given artist, regardless of what that artist actually was/is or aimed for? A bit like the way Brubeck is criticised.

Good question ... Some will probably and automatically reply by stating that "easy going" is synonymous with "not enough depth". Though I'd venture to say not all of those who proclaim to be able to absorb those "deep" and "complex" forms of jazz REALLY DO understand it inside out. They didn't then and they don't now. Nodding one's head in sophistication is one thing but REALLY absorbing it with every fiber despite everything that might just strike you as "far out" is quite another. In fact, IMHO it is more a matter of so many jazz lovers being conditioned exclusively on the jazz of that era performed by those "ANGRY YOUNG MEN" and if being angry (and the music that comes from it) is the key word then "easy going" or even "happiness" is just anathema to it all. Especially as it might very well challenge the very concept of this "angry" sort of jazz if you have to admit that at the same time there were other valid forms of jazz too if you are prepared to listen to it on its OWN merits. That said, I agree with all the good that has been said about his MGM recordings. His Capitol recordings are a mixed bag indeed and you would have to pick the jazzier items carefully. The other day I played his "Shearing On Stage!" album and found it fair enough. Though his pretty feeble jokes he includes in his "emceeing job" as the bandleader do wear thin quite rapidly and sort of mar the overall effect of the music as such. But did Shearing claim all of his Capitol stuff was hard core jazz any more than the latter-day Wes Montgomery or George Benson did with THEIR works? OTOH maybe us "Yurpeans" aren't the most "objective" persons to judge Shearing anyway. Considering the substantial influence of the "Shearing sound" on a lot of what was happening in jazz in EUROPE in the 50s (in Germany and Sweden, for example) I think we do tend to approach his music from a slightly different angle and maybe give him more leeway than others would.

Frank Teschemacher. Bix Beiderbecke. (No, just like in the case of the abovementioned Fats Navarro jazz doesn't come in album doses only - far from it, so if you wish, take this to mean "three albums' worth of material" ) Oh yeah - and lest I forget: Chu Berry Charlie Christian

Luckily they aren't Spanish, or else this series would be called "All my exits"!

Agree. Dont know if this happens in your neck of the woods but one thing that really bugs me is these dimwits who drive about - like you said, really oblivious to what's going around them - while holding their phone to their RIGHT ear with their LEFT hand, so wrapping their arm all around themselves and trying to do the steering AND shifting with that remaining right hand (remember most cars here still are stick shift ), now that's indeed something that I feel really uneasy about all the time. And I try to keep my distance from these characters in traffic. If they really are too one-sided or too dumb (or deaf?) to keep their hands on the side where they belong when seated behind the wheel then I cannot fathom they will be able to react like the should if they have to. Time to curb that nasty habit ...

Nothing. They've already been examining that theory, bottle in hand ... and out the window went the brain. And no doubt these days the beer industry can do with a "stimulus" too, you know. Otherwise, agree with the rest of your post.

I've seen it too. I think it's either in "Honkers & shouters" by Arnold Shaw, or the sleeve notes to a compilation set of R&B records made in Nashville (which I haven't got - but I saved it on the computer but can't remember where). MG That wouldn't be the "A Shot in The Dark" Nashvile R&B set by Bear Family? The accompanying book is a fat one but I cannot recall that Etta James was featured there. Neither was she on the Nashville R&B vinyl comps on the Krazy Kat label IIRC.

I'm afraid neither Buchreitz nor me will understand ANY of that - nor will anybody else. Whereas Swedish/Danish/Norwegian are lumped together in MANY printed media, for example, in Scandinavia where readers' contributions come into play (as you undoubtedly know ...) . OK, just to round off the debate and get back to Lbuchreitz's latest post (this time in English so Chris will spare us an avalanche of Icelandic ): Of course I see your point and I agree. But neither will you get a totally realistic appraisal from any moderately sharp-witted collector either who would be interested in BUYING these records himself. If he is to pay the items FULL PRICE that's not exactly an incentive to buy because it is not really a good buy (much less a bargain) for him. In short, try to get an appraisal of the value from an impartial third party (if there is anybody like that). But moaning about the fact that dealers (and even the keener type of collector) will not provide you with the info that will enable you to push up the prices of the items that THEY might be interested in buying from you is just natural. It has always been like that and is something to be reckoned with at all times IMHO (in EVERY part of any market where the price is dictated by collectability criteria). Good luck!

As long as there are fans who (just kidding, but with a grain of truth) go about boasting that they'd "gladly buy a 10-CD set of (insert favorite artist here) brushing his teeth" there will be a market for items such as this.

Jeff, you have to see this book (and the other one(s)) strictly from the angle of the times the individual articles were written in. I find his articles quite witty indeed and much to the point throughout and the coverage granted to his feuds with Panassié is just hilarious; though I wOnder whether all too many of those who bought these books primarily for the name of Vian when they were current in the 80s/90s were fully aware of that feud and therefore really were able to appreciate the finer points of Vian's acidic comments and allusions. I'd imagine indeed a lot of it was nightmarish to translate - I've read the two collations of his articles in German - actually quite well translated (as I've sInce seen from some of the originals in the 50s copies of Jazz Hot). The spirit is indeed there, but how do you translate the play on words in the spoof of the name of Hugues Panassié rendered as "Gugusse Papanasse" (or the like), for example, knowing that a "gugusse" is something like a dimwitted clown? I failed to buy the French editions of these collections of articles at a garage sale a cople of years ago but will catch up one of these days... Of course there are factual errors but Vian wasn't the only one who was wrong about certain facts of the history or the then-current events of jazz. Compared to what others let go into print I'd say he was one of the more aware ones (though you have to allow for the fact European jazz mags just were far removed from the heart of the events and up-to-date information was much more difficult to come by then). Recommended reading anyway!

Not wanting to sound cynical, but hasn't this been known for as long as people have handled diskettes (remember how they used to come down from 8" to 5.25" to 3.5"?) and have copied their favorite music (or data) on CD's (CR-R's)? I have some music in my collection that was burnt onto CD-R's more than 10 years ago and they still play fine but honestly, I would not want to trust them forever. Especially since even the life of commercially released CDs might be (relatively) limited too. And seeing how often my assertions that the pictures I still take on good ol' film rolls (with negatives being developed 'n all) will certainly outlast most photo files stored on some hard drive (external or not) have been met with condescending smiles I have now come to the point where problems such as those described in your post will raise nothing but a sneer from me. These people MUST have known better and acted accordingly or else they are just way too DUMB to manage archived materials at all - unfortunately!

Ah, I see - but now that's tricky. The title of an oft-recorded tune as the ALBUM title. Not the first thing that comes to mind when you read the THREAD title and are not that much into that period of Gillespiana. And amazingly not an album included in Goldmine's Price Guide (listing artist albums up to 1969).

MG, unless this is read by a real Dizzyphile who knows every track ever recorded by Diz inside and out and rattles off the reply, it might make a reply easier if you tell us which version of that tune it is exactly you are talking about (recording date, release, original release/label etc.). Because Diz must have recorded this tune I don't know how many tmies. I have two versions of this - one recorded for his Dee Gee label in 1951 and another one recorded live at Salle Pleyel in Paris in 1953 for Vogue. But these are not the ones you are talking about, of course.

Nice compilation for those who are totally new into the music but all others will probably have almost all of it. And uh oh ... turning the Cab's "Pickin' The Cabbage" into "Pickin' The GARBAGE" in the track listing. Hopefully not in the booklet. The Hi De Ho Man won't like it! And "Woody And You" is odd too.

So how come, then, that it has been possible to release such an extreme, immense quantity of transcriptions from that period for the enjoyment of collectors in (more or less) recent decades? Just wondering ...