Big Beat Steve

Like Stan Kenton's Capitol albums from the 50s. That happened in the CD era.

I guess many can chuckle because - as several forumists have hinted at before - this can be interpreted and discussed any number of ways and STILL be true because you just cannot generalize: - Very low pressing run = rare - but bad? Maybe yes, maybe no. - Poor distribution = rare. Bad? Maybe yes, maybe no. - A record that bombed and didn't sell because it WAS bad and therefore became rare? No doubt such cases exist. And I guess that in the flood of LP releases of the 50s (much bemoaned by many scribes st the time) there must have been quite a few of these. - Are there collectors who value rarity as an end in itself and tend to hear the music on the platter through rose-colored glases and find qualities in it that wasn't seen at the time (which is why the record dropped dead on release)? You bet there are! For a number of highly subjective reasons. Not least of all because criteria of "good" or "bad" can be subjective too. So this can be an endless discussion, with no definite judgment possible in many cases.

All set to continue reading with Vol. 2 as soon as it hits my mailbox so I for one am rarin' to go.

Some comments: 1) True, particularly with major names. But in the case of some artists there just may be conflicting (period) source material or evolving name uses over time. I realize this is probably not what you are thinking of (primarily) but this is a problem too and the boundaries can sometimes get blurred in certain niche releases. 2) What if the song titles deviated from the "published" titles way, way before the reissue was compiled, e.g. on the original label of decades ago? Try to turn back THAT clock too in each and every case? 3) Very true, but 100% accurate images may be lacking in some cases. 4) YES!!! This is one pet peeve of mine, though I have to admit that things have improved a lot since the 70s/early 80s when it was all too common to stick garish recent photographs on reissues from the 40s or 50s. An related problem (and part of my pet peeve, aside from using artwork graphics that don't fit the period of the music AT ALL) is: Don't EVER give in to the temptation to shift some work to some semi-talented "house artist" who just makes a blurred, blotched, ineptly abstracted mess of an existing photograph that those in the know clearly recognize but cannot help wondering what the point of "doing that up" was in the first place. 5) Obviously yes too. 6) Cardboard mini-LPs where you have a hard time trying to extract the CD from the all too slim and close-fitting sleeve are offenders too. 7) Could this logical order always be kept up over time? Just let some sort of change of company strategy happen and things get out of hand and numbering systems may change drastically.

Understandable and certainly more convenient in several ways but what would you do in the case of BIG BAND releases/reissues involving multiple seesions with only slightly shifting personnel? No more place for liner notes, then? . Besides, I wonder how the magazine scribes would have fared if your approach would have been the norm throughout. How would record reviewers have been able to cope with space constraints if they had not been able/allowed to use the "replaces" shortcut? No more personnel listings at all, or only main soloists? I doubt this would have been more convenient overall. Besides, your approach can backfire in those cases where the "out" convention is used (a likely but common alternative to what you seem to refer to as the "except" convention). Re-list the entire personnel even if only one or two men drop out from the line-up for specific tunes? Wouldn't this be over the top? But if you conceded the use of "out", why not the others, some will certainly ask. I cannot quite see an easy and consistent way out.

True, we are talking about a specific instance (and therefore horse). According to Google sources, some seem to disagree and use "the ..." in the same sense but I agree that, looking closer at it, this is not quite specific enough.

From over here across the pond, thanks for the reissue productions, liner notes and the Soul Jazz book. The name "Bob Porter" on a record sleeve spelled Quality. RIP

Anyway ... any way you look at it, actual use has run away from the definitions that you prefer that no doubt are correct by criteria agreed upon once upon a time but have become overly formulaic in the light of actual use. Not least of all because - as hinted at above - e.g. the degree of bodily reaction that you use as a criterion just isn't that rigidly applicable. Language evolves over time (for better or worse, but it does ...) Like it or not, "the horse done left the barn ...". But don't try to shoot me for it - I am just the messenger. "Nuff said" (on a totally different liguistic level). And apologies to Allen again for the off-topicness.

In the end it all depends on the extrovertness (or emotionalness? ) of the person concerned. But I think we are getting dangerously close to splitting hairs - not least of all because language (and its use) isn't totally static. Now the cringe vs wince theme may be a pet peeve of yours but OTOH if such fine distinctions were drawn EVERYWHERE in the English language and its (presumed) correct use then you'd have a handful to take care of if you'd follow this through - including on this forum, e.g. its use of affected streetwise gibberish or group slang by some, etc. And talking about dogs, I have yet to see you step up and take offense at the use of the word "dog" to address PERSONS, for example. So ... relax - please! (My apologies to Allen ... )

Yes, embarrassment for someone else seems to be the common denominator, correctly or incorrectly. (The way I have heard/read this used) But AFAICS this cringing CAN include embarrassment in the sense of almost feeling pain because of this embarrassment. Haven't we all at one time or another had a feeling that what someone else does or says makes you so embarrassed as to literally cause you bodily pain? No actual pain, of course, but the facial expression is there. So it's a fine line between wincing and actually cringing (for/about someone else) ... Mail sent. Thanks a lot!

Linguistically inclined, I checked several online sources, including the Cambridge dictionary (trying to find a definition of the difference) but find that definitions of their meaning (of wince on the once hand and of the - in most cases - "informal use" of cringe on the other) are very much the same. I am aware of both words and their use and while I'd take your word for your reasoning, could it be that "the horse done left the barn" a long time ago? Anyway, back to the topic, good to see that the review has had its effect. I am more than ever looking forward to receiving my copy of Part 2 of the book that accompanies the CD set.

In today's world, Google is the all-time best friend of your memory.

Talking about films and jazz fandom ... Strange thing ... Of course I've heard the name of Bertrand Tavernier quite a few times and have seen some of his films, but whenever I hear his name it is automatically "Elevator to the Gallows" ("Ascenseur pour l'Echafaud") that comes to mind - before I realize "no, that wasn't Bertrand!"

I had forgotten about the Cats vs Chicks 10-incher (which I own) as I was thinking of earlier recordings. (Pity if there are none) So Vivian Garry had more recording exposure in the heyday of 52nd Street, it seems.

Apart from Vivian Garry. Her all-female quintet session on RCA VIctor ("e.g. "A Woman's Place Is In The Groove" ) ought to be mandatory for this radio show - for the title alone ... As for Bonnie Wetzel, what records was she featured on? According to Bruyninckx, she did not participate in the recordings that the Soft Winds trio made.

Margie Hyams was in the list of artists mentioned in Ghost's opening post so I did not mention her. Of course she would have been "first pick" among those I am aware of. I wonder if the recently-deceased Viola ("with her 17 drums") ever played on 52nd St. in any aggregation?

Re- the above name calling: Wasn't Toshiko Akiyoshi way too late to be considered part of 52nd Street in the proer sense of the term? Isn't the feature supposed to focus on the HEYDAY of 52nd Street? At any rate, this is how i understood Ghost's initial query. As for Valaida Snow, after her European years of 1936-43 I can only find references to appearances at the Apollo Theater. But as for others who might fit the billl of (preferably) forties and early fifties female acts on 52nd Street, how about the combos of vibist/pianist Dardanelle (Breckenridge) and of bassist Vivian Garry? The well-known WIliam Gottlieb photos of 1947 do seem to prove their presence there.

So you underestimated the grumpiness of some?

Hand the tapes over to Jordi Pujol and see how it gets done!

This souds like europeans fared betteer, not only because of the Spotlite LP series but also earlier on the (U.K.) SAGA label which was around from the early 70s. @Rabshakeh, re- your question about why no Tadd Dameron or West Coast etc.: I for one in my first reply was focusing (as per your question) on EARLY bebop which made an impact on me in my EARLY bebop listening days. The Tadd Dameron recordings from the 40s are usually to be found among Fats Navarro reissues and the others that I have date from the 50s so IMO would not qualify as "early" bebop recordings. As for West Coast, isn't that quite a different playing field if we are talking about bebop here? But to get some West Coast in (though not the actual West Coast Jazz style), here is one that remains among my favorite recordings and reissue packagings: While on the subject of prestige, a nod also to this twofer that spans a wider range of artists that merit exploring:

They may serve a purpose if used for specific tracks, but ... I can't say I am that fond of these Roulette Echoes of an Era thrown-together twofer series that much .. Bought the Stan Getz one in my earlier collecting days (one of those purchases when you happen upon certain material at an affordable price first time and don't have the fuller overview yet) and it took me AGES to get those sessions (that had been part-reissued there) in a really coherent and virtually complete fashion elsewhere (particularly the Boston Storyville recordings) without having to worry and search too much about excessive duplications the other way. Grating ... (unless you dump these twofer right away - as soon as you find the compelte sessions including all you already have on these - and decide never to worry about having bought them in the first place) As for the above LPs, they will certianly have been good as appetizers and will have been worth it if picked up cheaply but isn't their programming nothing short of erratic and hodgepodge-ish too? Not from the point of view of today's completist box set "check-off-the-discography-entries" buyers but from a decent coherent full-session programming angle?

Bird is obvious, but here are some of the bebop LPs (not originals but by now fairly older eissues ) that got me right into the heart of bebop things way back in the 70s. Well-programmed and essential. And this one (since superseded by the RCA Black & White twofer but I still recqll teh impression it made)

Actually no, but that IS a nice one. Thanks for the hint!

Same here, but earlier and later. I started doing mix tapes some time in the early 80s as on-the-road listening entertainment for the car player in my 50s classic car(s) and have kept this up until some years ago. I still have quite a few of the tapes (some have become entangled or torn or otherwise unplayable). But the cassette players in my old cars now one after other giving up their ghost after s30 to 35+ years of faithful service. So I may make the move to CD-Rs at last. I usually program the tapes the way I'd program them for DJ sets at record hops (with maybe a shade more up-uptempo flagwavers, though ). The majority of my mix tapes were (real 50s) Rock'n'Roll, Rockabilly, Northern Band sound et al. tapes but as for JAZZ mix tapes, I did quite a lot of R&B tapes, often "theme tapes" such as several danceable jump blues mixes as well as "honkin' sax" compilations (though I've found that as I've advanced in years I've found I am less and less in the mood to work myself into a frenzy while at the wheel ). I also did lots of Western Swing (cum-Hillbilly boogie) mix tapes and several of these remain my all-time favorites for listening pleasure while driving. Some jazz mixes may appear oddball to some but they were/are highly entertaining. E.g. one that included all my versions of "Jumpin' at the Woodside" strung together, and another with all versions of "Rag Mop". Lately I've been thinking that I ought to do a mix tape or CD-R of all the versions of "Perdido" that I have, BTW. They all have that certain groove to me.

Eerie ... A kind of Newspeak??