Blue Train

I had no idea they even had coupons. How much money I could have saved over the last several years?!!! Thank you!!!!

1. Just why do you assume?...and you know what they say about assuming? 2. He's not in anyway close to being secure. His every one of these interviews prove that....if he really was secure in anyway....forget about just being anywhere near Susie ibarra were people might actuall take a picture of it....just record a single recording with her from the coward. Ware has been dead for how long and he's still not secure in anyway @ all. As in, if I wasn't clear enough before....Shipp being Shipp.

Never heard this before, but so Shipp-like! When he, or Parker (who is more boring with each recording without DA Drake!) once again ever are on the same stage, or record anything with Susie Ibarra is when I take either seriously again.

My opinion is that both Ware and Parker were envious that the NYT was doing a piece on her and not them....which lead to Joerg's hey, Ware and Parker have been doing this almost as long as she lived response.

This is what I have been able to piece together based on what people old enough @ the time....as well as one of my archaeological digs of the archives on JC. It started with the NYT doing a piece on her. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/rec.music.bluenote/aYSuwdr-iCg/b7rjcGwJm0wJ Steven Joerg who runs AUM Fidelity was also Ware's manager. He wrote a letter to the NYT basically saying she didn't pay her dues and was getting all the attention because of William Parker initially and being in Ware's band. http://www.nytimes.com/1999/06/13/arts/l-susie-ibarra-what-struggle-116173.html Then Assif Tsahar who was her husband @ the time started posting an open letter to Joerg all over the place. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.music.bluenote/LafWaYk97_o As you can imagine things went to hell from there. With both Joerg and Tsahar going off on each other. Musicians, reporters, fans got involved. It appears Parker and/or his wife somehow got involved in the feud. She left that band as well as Parker's groups she was in. Not a single person from that group has performed with her again that I know of, or anyone that who recorded for Aum Fidelity. She also hasn't been back to Vision Fest (that I know of) and this all happened back over a couple weeks in May - June 1999. She and Tsahar would get divorced not long after in the same year this all happened. At no time did Ware (or Shipp for that matter) come to her defense and no one thinks Joerg would have did what he did without Ware's okaying it. Of course, a lot of people and musicians rallied around her. Ware and the rest came out looking really bad. Zorn and his circle of musicians really took her under their wing so to speak. She is really the only one that came out looking good in the whole thing. Even Marian McPartland got involved. http://www.nytimes.com/1999/06/20/arts/l-susie-ibarra-unsung-drummers-207446.html Like I said an embarrassing clusterfuck.

Best thing about....it is that is an actual real video game.

When he became the most boring for me, but then he jumped the shark from me after the embarrassing clusterfuck that resulted in Susie Ibarra leaving.

I really do understand what you mean and have seen the Snakeoil band perform in the UK. As you pointed out, different band/sound completely. Like I said, I am glad they're able to make money....I really do hope it leads people to the real thing and those involved can make even more money, and become more well known. Yes and no for both.

IIRC Mr Berne posted here when Snake Oil was accused of much the same thing. He vehemently denied as far as I recall being under any pressure from ECM to smooth out his music to fit the label. He probably made more money and became more well known than all his own releases on his own label (which hasn't released anything for years now), but okay. He wasn't forced but when you go to ECM you already know what is expected. As in, Emo Jazz. I think that for a lot of listeners when an artist releases an album on ECM it's almost like they are getting a sort of stamp of approval. This might make them reassess an artists earlier work. Right or wrong i don't begrudge Berne any increased exposure or sales that might result from working with ECM. I really, really do see peoples point with regards to ECM taking the edges of artists (see my previous comment regarding Lloyd/Moran), but i am always slightly uncomfortable with the implication that they are selling out or playing in a style that they themselves don't want to play. Is it so hard to imagine that Berne wanted the Snakeoil album to sound exactly as it sounded? Don't get me wrong. I glad him and everyone that goes ECM is able to make money and it hopefully leads people to buying their really them recordings. Having said that. Would it have sounded exactly as it sounded without ECM being involved? He's been a recording artist for how long now? Like his playing or not.....Berne is one of those that his own "voice/sound" so to speak. If no one told anyone it was Tim Berne involved in anyway....would anyone believe it?

IIRC Mr Berne posted here when Snake Oil was accused of much the same thing. He vehemently denied as far as I recall being under any pressure from ECM to smooth out his music to fit the label. He probably made more money and became more well known than all his own releases on his own label (which hasn't released anything for years now), but okay. He wasn't forced but when you go to ECM you already know what is expected. As in, Emo Jazz.

I don't know man... i remember listening to an interview with Tim Berne aroud the time the first Snakeoil album came out where he talked about working with Eicher/ECM and how yes, he did tailor the sound to take advantage of the ECM aesthetic (or something along those lines). In other words no one held a gun to his head and he was really happy with the collaboration and resulting recording. He seems like a really straight up guy, didn't sound like he was talking shit although he might have been. As in, all about the Benjamins. Of course, he was happy.

GG Allin would have been closer to Pat Boone if Manfred Eicher was involved. Looking forward to the next release from the Emo Jazz label.

Like everyone of these kind of ECM releases....all those involved will play completely different than in their normal way of playing when not recording for ECM It's all about the Benjamins. As in, it might be Tim Berne, et al playing, but it's not really Tim Berne, et al playing.

When you have the cap space they have....you don't cut a player at such an important position to save just $500,000 or less....and they already cut a long-snapper that was also competing with Jennings. Also, they didn't become relevant again until Harbaugh & Trent Baalke took over. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhVMS-rqVMQ

Thanks for posting this. Shipp being Shipp. Shots @ everyone. Even the first close to semi-official thing on what happened with Susie Ibarra...as in, the best official drummer that group ever had. Should be interesting to read Chuck's response to Roscoe Mitchell being compared to Bill Evans and not the same "energy" as the East Coast.

Like every genre. It depends on what the person I am recommending to is already listening too. Most accessible would Jazz Advance, Looking Ahead, Love for Sale. He still hasn't gone completely "Cecil Taylor" and there are cover songs.

Take it from me.....in this day and age it's pretty tame.. There actually was even a Japanese band with a somewhat similar name in Japanese called Gerogerigegege. Their stage act from what I have been told at times included the acts and masturbation. Another interesting Japanese band name is Ana-dorei. There is a group called "Turbonegro"...who were considering Nazipenis as the other alternative for their name.

Most of this is worthless to read, but anyone ready for Blue Note speakers, wine, clothes, and coffee? http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20130830/NEWS/309019994/qa-don-was

NIN is released two different mastered versions of their latest recording. http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/28/4667966/nin-audiophile-mastered-version-hesitation-marks

This year's Earshot Festival. http://www.earshot.org/Festival/festival.html

Revenue is expected to be $25 billion in 15-years....in the meantime by the time they finally pay off the money in 20-years....the cost of inflation would lesson the value of the remaining 17-years paid. They're probably going to lose another 25-35% of the money's value on top of what they're going to pay the lawyers. What is $75,000-$100,000 going to do for anyone with Dementia? That's like one year's worth of treatment...and they're not even getting it one lump sum payment. This settlement also kept the NFL from opening up it's records on concussions. Current players and future players are screwed because they can't say they don't know the about the risks and accept the liability....it also would be covered under the CBA. Goodell got a new contract that doubles his salary after getting the NFLPA to kowtow for the last CBA. Who knows how much more he's going to get in the future now that he got the Refs and the former players to do the same.

For the non-Jazz stuff. http://www.newyorkcitytheatre.com/common/events_calendar.php?year=2013&month=10&day=31 If you're into Shakespeare....both of these are a must. Saw the UK productions, which they're bringing to NYC. http://www.newyorkcitytheatre.com/theaters/belascotheater/twelfth-night.php http://www.newyorkcitytheatre.com/theaters/belascotheater/richard-iii.php Not sure what kind of Jazz you're into, but something general for now. http://www.gothamjazz.com/index.html http://www.nyjazzreport.com/

I think the name has to do with the drummer. Obviously into extreme metal....not that there is any problem with that for me. Even the whole corpse paint and bands shirts. Probably also explains the names of several of the tracks. I actually think the drummer is the weak link. Maybe once he plays in more in this type of setting than he's used too....that could change. Lots of metal drummers come from a Jazz influenced background. No reason that can't be reversed given time. To answer the main question. I don't consider them that experimental, or breaking with expectations....unless they mean expectations of those that already know them from other non-Jazz projects in other genres/sub-genres of music. Don't get me wrong there is some good stuff in there.

Like the deal the NLFPA agreed too after the last strike and the NFL refs agreed too after their strike....the concession settlement for the former players is yet another major win for the NFL. It's really a joke. $765 million sounds like a lot, but there are potentially thousands of players....and you figure a third of that amount is probably going to the lawyers who represented the former players. Each team is going to pay a total of $23.9 million over 20-years. With around $4 million of that for each of the first 3-years and and around $700,000 for each of the remaining 17-years. Top it off....all the teams have to do is add the amount they're they would have to pay to their internal player budget (which they legally can do..)....and that means less money for current, future players over those 20-years. The teams won't even notice it. The NLFPA really can't say much (and has stayed out most everything) because they're afraid they will be sued by the former players. The NLFPA after all approved the NFL's handling of concussions in the past.

They were never going to be that good anyway. On the positive side. It puts them in the Jadeveon Clowney hunt. If they didn't overreach for Manuel; they might have been in the hunt for Bridgewater, or Boyd next year.