Rooster_Ties

You're right Conn500, that this is a difficult topic to talk about. Maybe that's why I sat around thinking about talking about it for so long, before finally starting this thread. I was about to discuss my own background, which isn't even half as interesting as yours, Conn500. I think you certainly bring a unique perspective to matters of race. I grew up in a nearly lily-White suburb of St. Louis (Missouri), in what must be one of the most segregated counties in the whole country, St. Clair County, on the Illinois side of the river, right across the river from St. Louis. Yup, I grew up in the county where East St. Louis is, where Miles was born and grew up. But I grew up in and around Belleville, Illinois - which is probably 70% White now, and back then (in the 70's and 80's) was probably 85% White. But my parents, who were born in the late 20's (and are old enough to be my grandparents), both grew up in East St. Louis when it was nearly all-White, as it was all the way through the 30's, 40's, and 50's. Lot's of reasons for the big changes in East St. Louis, which I won't go into here, except to say that now it is nearly 90% Black, and one of the most economically depressed areas in the whole country, and is quite similar to the south side of Chicago, or the Watts area of Los Angeles. I grew up in a number of different schools, which each had about 5%-10% minority enrolment. And when I went to college, I got to interact with lots of international students, from all over the world. But, for many reasons, I don’t remember having too much interaction with the Black students who I was in college with at the time. I went to a small liberal-arts college in up-state Illinois, with about 15% minority enrolment, about half of which was Black. I do remember going to hear some lectures, now and then, that particularly appealed to the Black student community, and being at a few sort of “Black”-centric student events. But, I don’t really remember ever really getting to know any Black students during my time in college. I saw every movie Spike Lee put out, but never did figure out how to cross that divide. I wasn’t into jazz back then, though I suspect few of the Black students were either. I’m rambling here, and have no idea where this is going. I guess I don’t have any answers either. But I think talking about race is still a good thing, and a good place to start. Back to rambling... It wasn’t until my first year out of college, when I began working on my 2nd college degree (in music), that I got to develop a really good friendship with someone who was Black. Actually, he was a part-time professor at the college (and a full-time professor at the local community college), and he was going to be on my Honors-Project committee when I thought about doing a year-long project on Sun Ra. He had the biggest jazz collection within 300 miles in any direction, and the area he taught in was Sociology. We hit it off fast, first as mentor and student, but later just as friends. He’s 20-25 years older than I am, but we’ve really gotten to be good friends despite the age difference. He and his wife are two of the nicest people I’ve ever known in my whole life. He has kids that are only a few years younger than I am, and they’re also really nice as well - though I always feel I have way more in common with their father (who is easily old enough to be my own father), than I do any of them (he has three sons). Conn500, you’re absolutely right about race being a taboo subject. There have been nearly 100 views of this thread, but only two people have responded to it. Difficult to talk about, but perhaps important to talk about too.

Thanks b3, appreciate your feedback. Nice to hear stories like the one you described about the gay man, and the black woman her friends. I would just post links to these, but articles in the Kansas City Star are only available on-line for one week; after that you gotta buy the articles for a tiny fee. So, here are two articles, the first one ran before the 'Race Relations' forum I attended last Saturday, and the second one ran right after the forum. and

What's "...Freap" sound like??? I've never heard it... (And actually, I'm not sure if I've ever heard any Ronnie Foster, come to think of it.)

I have far fewer of the Rare Groove titles, so I'll have to bow out from the Rare Groove poll, at least as far as knowing what to add, and what not to.

( Never mind the bit about "Select your favorite Grant Green from the list", I think that's a left-over from another poll Conn500 created earlier... )

I've wanted to bring up this topic for a long time, both here and even back on the BNBB, so here goes... Maybe I should also mention, right up front, that I'm a white male, married, age 34, with no kids, who lives in the city in a mostly all-white neighborhood, although about 15% of our immediate neighbors (within 1 or 2 miles) are Hispanic. But, if you go just 2 or 3 miles due east of where I live, you start to get into the mostly all-Black neighborhood. (Kansas City, like I suspect most (but maybe not all?) bigger cities in America, borders on being 'hyper-segregated' in our living/neighborhood patterns.) I'm currently unemployed (since January), but my last work environment ('white collar', in Information Systems at the corporate headquarters of a Fortune 1000 company) was probably 90% White, with the remaining 10% mostly being made of up of various Asian, Indian, and Middle-Eastern minorities, with few Blacks. Anyway, last Saturday I went to an interesting forum/round-table discussion, about the state of "Race Relations" in Kansas City and in the greater K.C. metropolitan area. At this forum, there was a period of Q&A with the panel - and one of my questions was selected and discussed by the whole group. My question was this: "Kansas City is not very integrated, especially in our neighborhoods, our churches, and (although maybe to a lesser degree) in many of our work environments. What can White people do to get involved in improving race relations?? And, perhaps even more importantly, what can White people do to find ways to interact and socialize in more racially integrated circles??" Various members of the panel had a few good suggestions, but the overall response (and struggle to respond) left me thinking that this really is a difficult question to answer, or at least here , and it probably is also in many communities. So, then, I pose the same question here... For those interested, what can we all do (Black, White, Hispanic, Asian, etc...) to have more face-to-face interaction, in a positive and comfortable/casual setting, on a periodic regular basis, with people of different racial backgrounds?? For instance, I belong to a very dogmatically-liberal Unitarian Church in midtown Kansas City - where the social-circle I run in there (made up of mostly "30-somethings") has every kind of diversity you can think of, except racial diversity. And by other kinds of diversity, I mean things like gender, class (or at least income-level), gender-preference, single/married, kids/no-kids, city-dwellers/suburbanites, professionals, artists, students, you-name-it, and so on.... But as much as I like all that, I would love to find some regular social outlets that were more racially mixed. A while back I played in a pool-league for a couple years, and our 'all-White' team sometimes played 'all-Black' teams - sometimes at our bar, sometimes at theirs, and I really enjoyed that. And I had some cool conversations once with a couple slightly-younger-than-me Black guys when we were all in a jury pool together all day long, a few years ago. And one or two of the jazz clubs in Kansas City draw a mixed crowd, somewhat. But you see my point - (at least in this town) one has to really look for opportunities to mix with others who are different. And even then, there often isn’t that much interaction. Any thoughts on my questions above, or about this topic in general??? Thanks!! -- Rooster T. PS: Yes, I'll admit it, based on my personal interests in Jazz, (perhaps obviously) I'm looking for more opportunities for Black/White interaction. But, that doesn't mean I'm any less open to other more diverse social-circles as well.

List of Pulitzer Prize Winners in Music, 1943-2002 1943: William Schuman (b. 1910). Secular Cantata No. 2: A Free Song for full chorus of mixed voices, with accompaniment of orchestra. 1944: Howard Hanson (1896-1981). Symphony no. 4, op. 34. 1945: Aaron Copland (1900-1990). Appalachian Spring. 1946: Leo Sowerby (1895-1968). The Canticle of the Sun. 1947: Charles Ives (1874-1954). Symphony no. 3. 1948: Walter Piston (1894-1976). Symphony no. 3 1949: Virgil Thomson (1896-1989). Louisiana Story. (Score for a documentary film.) 1950: Gian-Carlo Menotti (b. 1911). The Consul. (Opera.) 1951: Douglas Moore (1893-1969). Giants in the Earth. (Opera.) 1952: Gail Kubik (1914-1984). Symphony Concertante. 1953: Not awarded. 1954: Quincy Porter (1897-1966). Concerto Concertante for Two Pianos and Orchestra. 1955: Gian-Carlo Menotti (b. 1911). The Saint of Bleecker Street. (Opera in three acts.) 1956: Ernst Toch (1887-1964). Symphony no. 3. 1957: Norman Dello Joio (b. 1913). Meditations on Ecclesiastes. 1958: Samuel Barber (1910-1981). Vanessa. (Opera.) 1959: John La Montaine (b. 1920). Concerto for Piano and Orchestra, op. 9. 1960: Elliott Carter (b. 1908). Second String Quartet. 1961: Walter Piston (1894-1976). Symphony no. 7. 1962: Robert Ward (b. 1917). The Crucible. (Opera.) 1963: Samuel Barber (1910-1981). Piano Concerto no. 1, op. 38. 1964: Not awarded. 1965: Not awarded. 1966: Leslie Bassett (b. 1923). Variations for Orchestra. 1967: Leon Kirchner (b. 1919). Quartet no. 3 for strings and electronic tape. 1968: George Crumb (b. 1929). Echoes of Time and the River. 1969: Karel Husa (b. 1921). String Quartet no. 3. 1970: Charles Wuorinen (b. 1938). Time's Encomium. 1971: Mario Davidovsky (b. 1934). Synchronisms no. 6. 1972: Jacob Druckman (1928-1996). Windows. 1973: Elliott Carter (b. 1908). String quartet no. 3. 1974: Donald Martino (b. 1931). Notturno. 1975: Dominick Argento (b. 1927). From the Diary of Virginia Woolf. 1976: Ned Rorem (b. 1923). Air Music. 1977: Richard Wernick (b. 1934). Visions of Terror and Wonder. 1978: Michael Colgrass (b. 1932). Deja Vu for Percussion and Orchestra. 1979: Joseph Schwantner (b. 1943). Aftertones of Infinity. 1980: David Del Tredici (b. 1937). In Memory of a Summer Day. 1981: Not awarded. 1982: Roger Sessions (1896-1985). Concerto for Orchestra. 1983: Ellen Zwilich (b. 1939). Three Movements for Orchestra. (Symphony no. 1.) 1984: Bernard Rands (b. 1934). Canti del Sole. 1985: Stephen Albert (1941-1992). Symphony RiverRun. 1986: George Perle (b. 1915). Wind Quintet no. 4, for flute, oboe, clarinet, horn, and bassoon. 1987: John Harbison (b. 1938). The Flight into Egypt. 1988: William Bolcom (b. 1938). 12 New Etudes for Piano. 1989: Roger Reynolds (b. 1934). Whispers Out of Time. 1990: Mel D. Powell (1923-1998). Duplicates: A Concerto. 1991: Shulamit Ran (b. 1947). Symphony. 1992: Wayne Peterson (b. 1927). The Face of the Night. 1993: Christopher Rouse (b. 1949). Trombone Concerto. 1994: Gunther Schuller (b. 1925). Of Reminiscences and Reflections. 1995: Morton Gould (1931-1996). Stringmusic. 1996: George Walker (b. 1922). Lilacs for soprano and orchestra. 1997: Wynton Marsalis (b. 1961). Blood on the Fields. Oratorio. 1998: Aaron Jay Kernis (b. 1960). String Quartet No. 2, Musica Instrumentalis 1999: Melinda Wagner. Concerto for Flute, Strings, and Percussion. 2000: Lewis Spratlan. Life is a Dream, opera in three acts: ACT II, Concert Version. 2001: John Corigliano. Symphony No. 2 for String Orchestra. 2002: Henry Brant. "Ice Field"

From http://www.villagevoice.com by Gary Giddins The Academy's Pulitzer Why Jazz and Pop Don't Make the Cut April 30 - May 6, 2003 John Adams takes a stand. (photo: Hiroyuki Ito) On April 9, the Times ran a surprising story by Anne Midgette, "Dissonant Thoughts on the Music Pulitzers," in which John Adams, who had received the award for On the Transmigration of Souls, expressed astonishment at winning, and ambivalence bordering on contempt. The prize, he said, has "lost much of the prestige it still carries in other fields," because "most of the country's greatest musical minds" are ignored, "often in favor of academy composers." He singled out the Pulitzer's neglect of mavericks, composer-performers, and "especially" the "great jazz composers." His point was not surprising; that a recipient made it was. He had said aloud what countless American composers grumble privately every year, most of them shy of going public and courting accusations of sour grapes. In 1967, when Edward Albee won a makeup Pulitzer for A Delicate Balance, he said that friends urged him to refuse it; in 1963, the drama jury had chosen to present no award rather than acknowledge Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf. In effect, Albee argued that his dissent would have more meaning as a winner. As he went on to win more Pulitzers, if he contested them at all, he kept it quiet. Adams took a nervy stand, opening himself to allegations of biting the hand that massaged him. Not many winners have publicly questioned the process since Sinclair Lewis spurned the prize in 1926 (as well he should, Arrowsmith having beaten The Great Gatsby, though that wasn't his reason). And Adams loosened other lips. John Corigliano, the 2001 winner, told Midgette, "The Pulitzer was originally intended to be for a work that is going to last, to mean something to the world. It changed into another kind of award completely: by composers for composers"—mired, he added, in a pool of rotating jurors. The Pulitzer Prizes, launched with a fourth of Joseph Pulitzer's $2 million bequest to create the Columbia University School of Journalism, began presenting laurels in journalism and literature in 1917. The music prize was instituted in 1943, the year of Ellington's Black, Brown and Beige; the prize, however, went to William Schuman's A Free Song, a respectable choice by an important composer who was already a magnet for prizes. In the jazz world, the Pulitzer is shrugged off as just another establishment club (from the Grammys to the Kennedy Center Honors) that routinely ignores composers working in the idiom that most consistently and articulately proclaims "America" to the rest of the world. Yet many civilians are amazed to learn that in its 60 years, the Pulitzer has never acknowledged a single figure in popular music and only once gave the nod to a jazz work—Wynton Marsalis's Blood on the Fields, in 1997. Gunther Schuller and Mel Powell have also won, but for pieces entirely unconnected to their jazz work. The most celebrated pas de deux between the Pulitzers and jazz occurred in 1965, when the jury unanimously voted to override the standard rule of honoring a single work premiered the previous year, in order to hail Duke Ellington for his lifetime achievement. The jury, to its dismay, was overruled by the advisory board, which chose to present no award that year. A Pulitzer spokesman later argued that the single-work rule could not be broken; but if they had wanted to make things right at the time, they could have given it to Ellington the next year for the premiere of his masterpiece, Far East Suite—or for several subsequent suites debuted before his death in 1974. Yet had the advisory board acknowledged any of those works, it would have done little more than apply a Band-Aid to a triple bypass. The real problem went to the heart of Pulitzer politics: It was the rule itself. The jury that desired to honor Ellington understood something about indigenous American music—it is different; it plays a different game. The board would look foolish giving it to one new song by Bob Dylan or one typical concert by Sonny Rollins. The congregate achievement is almost always what counts. Lester Young was a great composer not because of his riff tunes, but because he created a new and inspired canvas in American music; as instantly recognizable as an Aaron Copland ballet, Young's canvas was as amorphous as Leaves of Grass, his every improvisation another leaf, some greener than others, all part of one visionary achievement. It is easy to retrospectively find jazz compositions that ought to have been recognized within the constraints of the Pulitzer rulebook, but to say that A Love Supreme is eligible, and not the composer's lifework, is to force jazz to conform to the very 19th-century Eurocentric model it supplanted. Similarly, Irving Berlin or Woody Guthrie's songbooks are not only more popular than Pulitzer compositions, they also come far closer to answering Corigliano's call for "work that is going to last, to mean something to the world." The Pulitzer is not averse to Band-Aids. It has a separate category called Special Awards and Citations, which has, in 73 years of occasional prize-giving, acknowledged three pop or jazz figures: Scott Joplin in 1976 (59 years after his death), George Gershwin in 1998 (61 years after his death), and Duke Ellington in 1999 (25 years after his death). The Ellington presentation was made "in recognition of his musical genius, which evoked aesthetically the principles of democracy through the medium of jazz and thus made an indelible contribution to art and culture." In short, it was a lifetime achievement award. And that's the right idea. The trick is to present the award while the recipient is breathing, and in the Music category proper, not in a remedial "duh" division. Ironically, on the one occasion when the board approved a jazz award, the jury played a shell game with its chief edict, recognizing a 1997 "premiere" at Yale University, although the work had been recorded in 1995. Adams, in listing a few non-winners for the Times, mentioned John Cage, Morton Feldman, Harry Partch, Conlon Nancarrow, Steve Reich, Philip Glass, Terry Riley, Meredith Monk, Thelonious Monk, and Laurie Anderson, as well as the general category of "great jazz composers." He would like to impose a more radical sensibility on a historically conservative institution. (Consider fiction: Laughing Boy beat The Sound and the Fury and A Farewell to Arms; Years of Grace beat As I Lay Dying, The Maltese Falcon, and Flowering Judas; Now in November beat Tender Is the Night and Appointment in Samarra; and the board could find no worthy fiction at all in the years For Whom the Bell Tolls, Native Son, The Hamlet, The Adventures of Augie March, V, Idiots First, Losing Battles, and Gravity's Rainbow were eligible.) But the issue as it regards jazz is no longer about radical or conservative views of culture; the influence, constancy, and genius of American music is denied nowhere—and none of it is represented in the Pulitzer rolls. Does it matter? Of course it does. Owing to its long history and the press's psychic investment in the journalistic (and primary) wing of its prize-giving, the Pulitzer has a visibility and cachet beyond other cultural awards. The Times doesn't phone recipients of National Book Awards or American Music Center Letters of Distinction for human-interest reports on how they felt when they heard their names called. The Pulitzer, like it or not, is America's big award, a kind of sanctioning. Only rank stubbornness can rationalize prolonging a slight that should have been rectified decades ago. A couple of weeks after the Pulitzers were handed out, the AMC awarded its Letters of Distinction to George Crumb, the Voice's Kyle Gann (a distinguished composer as well as a critic), Steve Reich, Wayne Shorter, and the late music publisher Ronald Freed. Shorter is the ringer in this group, but not among previous AMC recipients, who include—in addition to most of Adams's mavericks and many who've won Pulitzers—Randy Weston, Max Roach, Modern Jazz Quartet, Dizzy Gillespie (posthumously), Muhal Richard Abrams, Cecil Taylor, and Ornette Coleman. All but Gillespie and most of the MJQ are living, and it's hard to imagine anyone questioning the appropriateness of awarding any of them Pulitzers. There are others deserving of consideration, including Rollins, Dylan, Benny Carter, George Russell, B.B. King, Lee Konitz, Henry Threadgill, Abbey Lincoln, Art Ensemble of Chicago, Ray Charles, Aretha Franklin, Andrew Hill, Jim Hall, Chuck Berry, Roy Haynes, Pete Seeger, James Brown, and David Murray. Should the Pulitzer board decide to rejigger its rule book or expand its grasp, it would have to overcome the embarrassment of an awfully interesting mea culpa, something on the order of "The Pulitzer Prize in Music has decided to accept the reality of American music and will no longer dismiss out of hand all composers who swing or sanction improvisation." But the real difficulty would be administrative. The divides among jazz and pop and the academy remain so vast that in selecting its jurors in any given year, the committee will have virtually decided which area to favor; word would have to be leaked that the barriers have come down, because few non-academics submit nominations. Put a couple of jazz people on the jury and the dice are loaded for jazz. Still, better to switch loaded dice from one year to the next than to use—as is now the case—the same pair every year.

I drive a 1992 Honda Accord wagon, and love it!! Wish they hadn't discontinued the the wagon here in the U.S. - although perhaps this might mean that they would bring it back in a couple years??? I think wagons sell better in Europe than in the U.S., where those damn SUV's are all the rage. Here's a pic of the new Accord wagon (only in Europe)

Same here rooster. My wife and I saw him play during his Midnight Vultures tour. Phenomenal. The showmanship, the music, electric and acoustic was great! We had so much fun. The show ended with an encore followed by about ten minutes of noise, robots bending each other over, bandmembers destroying the set, comedic chaos. We loved it! If anyone buys this Lonnie Smith, please post a review. I'm curious! Yup, it was the same tour we saw, the Midnight Vultures tour. Your description matches our experience. Most fun I've ever had at a rock concert, and the band was incredible.

I went to a Beck show a couple years ago, on a whim. I knew what I knew of his music from the radio and MTV/VH1, but didn't own any of his albums. To this day, that concert was one of the best rock concerts I've ever been to in my whole life. More fun than I could possibly describe. I didn't know but a half-a-dozen of his tunes, but really had a great time, and the band was tight, tight, tight!!!! Beck's the real deal, from what I can tell.

You gotta see this.... http://home.attbi.com/~bernhard36/honda-ad.html

OK, I'm finally posting my thoughts about this topic... And, strangely enough - I just realized that most of the choices in my "top-16" list are dates that were unreleased for many years, until they finally came out in the 70's, 90's, or even later. The only ones that were released near the time when they were recorded were: the first half of "Lift Every Voice", "Complete Communion", "Judgement", "Basra", and "Fuschia Swing Song" - and (depending on how you look at it), "The Complete 'IS' Sessions" (which were released in an incredibly slipshod way over the years). What does that say about my tastes???? (...that nearly 2/3rds of these titles sat in the vaults for 10-35 years???) "Top 16 Conns" 1. Wayne Shorter - Etcetera 2. Hank Mobley - Third Season 3. Andrew Hill - Lift Every Voice 4. Chick Corea – The Complete 'IS' Sessions 5. Don Cherry – Complete Communion 6. Lee Morgan – The Procrastinator 7. Andrew Hill - Judgement 8. Jackie McLean – Jacknife 9. Bobby Hutcherson - Medina/Spiral 10. Grant Green - Solid 11. Lee Morgan - Infinity 12. Pete La Roca - Basra 13. Dizzy Reece – Comin’ On 14. Larry Young - Mother Ship 15. Andrew Hill - Tomorrow is Now!! 16. Sam Rivers - Fuschia Swing Song "Honorable Mention" Andrew Hill - Grass Roots Wayne Shorter – The All-Seeing Eye / Schizophrenia Jackie McLean – Destination Out! / ‘Bout Soul / Vertigo Bobby Hutcherson - Patterns / Stick-up! Grachan Moncur III – Some Other Stuff Larry Young – Into Somethin’ Hank Mobley - A Slice of the Top Tina Brooks – Minor Move / Back to the Tracks / The Waiting Game Grant Geen – Green Street / Sunday Mornin’ Booker Ervin – Structurally Sound / The In-between Donald Byrd – Byrd in Flight Johnny Coles – Little Johnny C Dizzy Reece – Blues in Trinity Horace Parlan – On the Spur of the Moment / Us Three PS: My favorite "Rare Groove" CD's are also previously unreleased sessions, that didn't ever come out until the 90's... John Patton - Boogaloo Donald Byrd - Donald-Kofi Also, the only Conn I have that I don't really care for all that much, is.... Don Wilkerson – The Complete Blue Note Sessions FYI, if I'm remembering what I've got right, then I've got 66/99 of the Conns (in some form or another, TOCJ, Mosiac, etc...)

Check out the sound samples from this guy's albums (his name is Michael Rabinowitz, see links down below for sound samples, AMG entry, and AMG reviews), and, both his albums have John Hicks!! Sounds pretty interesting to me - both on paper, as well as the sound samples. Anybody have either of his albums?? Thanks!!! -- Rooster T. ===== Source: www.ejazznews.com: Improvising Bassoon <-- LINK Improvising Bassoon Posted on: May 05, 2003 - 08:54 AM by editor Dear Friends: Recently, I taped my next one-hour show for the "Jazz From the Archives" series. Presented by the Institute of Jazz Studies, the series runs every Sunday on WBGO-FM (88.3). The bassoon is a fiendishly difficult woodwind instrument, and one could probably count the number of improvising bassoon players in jazz history, beginning with Garvin Bushell and Frank Trumbauer in the 1920s, on little more than the fingers of both hands. More often than not, these players have been saxophonists who "double" on the instrument. What sets Michael Rabinowitz (b. 1955) apart from the majority of jazz bassoonists is that he counts the bassoon as his primary instrument. Rabinowitz has been on the New York City jazz scene for more than twenty years, and he now has an international reputation as a unique, first-rate improviser. We'll sample from his recordings with the Charles Mingus Orchestra, the Bill Kirchner Nonet, and his own groups. The show will air this Sunday, May 11, from 11 p.m. to midnight, Eastern Daylight Time. NOTE: If you live outside the New York City metropolitan area, WBGO also broadcasts on the Internet at www.wbgo.org. Best, Bill Kirchner www.jazzsuite.com ===== and Main AMG bio of Michael Rabinowitz here: LINK AMG review of his first album (from 1995, with John Hicks), called: "Gabrielle's Balloon" <-- LINK Sound samples at bn.com: LINK AMG entry (no review) of his second album (from 1996, also with John Hicks), called: "Bassoon on Fire" <-- LINK Sound samples at bn.com: LINK ===== Any other jazz bassoonists I should know about??? The only one's I can think of are sax guys in Sun Ra's band, who doubled on bassoon. Too lazy to try and find their names right now, but I know I've got more than a couple Sun Ra albums/CD's that have bassoon, not just as a background instrument, but full-blown bassoon solos. Any more jazz bassoon soloists I should know about?? - especially any guys who recorded after 1950, or after 1960???

I voted for #5 too. You know, I've found over the years that many musicians are less steeped in the music than many fans. They're often too busy making music, to be as obsessive about listening.

Yeah, I hate the packaging format of the Herbie and Dexter sets too. I've never owned the Dexter set, but the Herbie set is a royal pain in the ass. Same thing with the Bob Marley and Police box sets too. Hopefully all of Herbie's output will be RVG-ed (with all the bonus tracks included), which would eliminate the need for the box set. And about the booklet - my Herbie box booklet was torn when I first got it, right out of the shrinkwrap. Piss-poor design, if you ask me. The "complete Miles Davis" boxes on Columbia are far better, although some of what's in 'em is impossible to read, cuz the type is either too small, or (even worse!!) they print yellow text on top of a yellow background. (In the "IASW" box). Who the fuck's idea what that!!!

OK, I own hardly any Coltrane on CD (nor on LP or that matter), but if I was thinking about take the plunge and getting this box set of his entire Atlantic output, is there a downside to getting this particular set?? I seem to remember reading that additional alternate takes are being released on the subsequent (and more recent) CD issues of these individual albums?? (Are there many alternate takes on the individual CD's that aren't on this box set??) Or, is this more of a problem with the "The Classic Quartet: Complete Impulse! Studio Recordings" vs. the newest individual CD's of Trane's 'Impulse!' material?? ( I'm pretty sure I'm more interested in his Atlantic output (to start with), rather than the Implulse! material. ) Am I better off getting the 'Atlantic Years' Coltrane box, or the individual CD's??? ( FYI, SACD is of no concern to me, nor DVD-A - or whatever those new-fangled formats are. Well mastered/re-mastered standard CD's are good enough for me - though I do realize (and agree) that plenty of late 80's and even early 90's CD's are not nearly as good as some more recent 'standard CD' issues of the same material. ) ===== Also, while I'm at it, what's the "most decent" price I could expect to pay for a good 'used' copy of the Complete Trane Atlantic Years set on CD??? Anybody got one (or an extra one) that they're lookin' to get rid of??? (Or know where I can find a good one cheap??) $$$ is really tight for me now, but I think I just might be interested in diving into some serious Trane for the first time in my life. Thanks!!!

What else by Roach fit's the pre-"STRATA-EAST" mold?? I only have "Members Don't Get..." Whattami missing???

How much better is this: than this: ????? Looks like the track listing is identical, so there are no bonus tracks on the newest one?? So, then, is the sound quality light years better?? I can get a used one of the old CD issue (which appears to date from 1992), for only $9 (including shipping). Or, I can probably pay $15-$16 for the newest issue. What's the best way to go??

Idle Moments is really good, probably a close 2nd for me. But I had to go with "Solid", which is such an incredible date, with an incredible line-up. Love the combination of Joe Henderson and James Spaulding. Now, if I were only thinking about Green's playing, and not also the context - that would be a more difficult question. While I do really love Grant Green's playing, I come to most of his CD's a little late in the game. I have plenty of Green's CD's now, but as recently as 2-3 years ago, I didn't have all that many. Silly me - I wasn't all that interested in jazz guitar (in general), and I didn't focus much on Green, untill I realized all the incredible sidemen who were on all his albums. Then, I quickly came to realize what a great player Green was, reguardless of who he was playing with. Anyway, "Solid" is probably the one Grant Green disc I think of first and most of all, when it comes to Green.

My GOD, you damned FREAK!!! Don't ever post here again!!!!

Now I expect you to create at least two new polls every week. Go forth, and pollster!!! ( )

I'll second that!! (And no, I'm not a drummer by nature, but for this album - I would definitely feel the urge to make some noise along with it!!!)