Rooster_Ties

Thanks for the kind words, Jazzmoose. I too wish I could find more conversation-space like this, both on-line, and in the 'real world' too. And actually, that was kinda what this thread was all about in the first place --- about me trying to find ways to have conversations like this (or constructive conversations (and opportunities for such conversations) of some sort, any sort really) with people of different races. Some good news - Just today I discovered that there's a monthly (or maybe it's every other week) breakfast-meeting between members of our church (which is 90% White, 7% "other, non-Black", and 3% Black -- I'm guessing at those stats, but you get the idea) and members of an "all-Black" church that's also here in Kansas City. Time to get on the horn and find out when the next meetin' is, and get my tail down there to it. Does anybody else here on the Organissimo board live in a 'hypersegregated' city?? - meaning a city where the living/neighborhood paterns are divided very strongly by race?? Kansas City is like that, and I remember St. Louis (where I grew up) as being like that too (although to a slightly lesser degree). I'm sure I'm not the only one here in this boat, but I seem to be the only one in this kind of situation who's contributing to this thread. If anybody's reading this thread, and not contributing - please consider joining in. I know this isn't nearly as much 'fun' as most of the other political threads, but I would appreciate some other perspectives on this topic. Thanks!!

I've got the "Who's Crazy" set on CD, and there's a chance I might be willing to part with it. I haven't spun it in a long, long time. And if it's been that long, then I'm temped to consider whether I really need it or not. I make no promises, but I'll give it a spin a few times over the next couple days, and see if I feel the desparate urge to keep it or not. (David, you've got right of first refusal, if I decide to part with it - that is if you're interested.)

I'll hafta look through the list, and get back to you, A.B. - many of these are pretty obscure, and I'm not sure the Pulitzer really goes to the best work or best composer each year. (Duh, that was the point of the story, to some degree.) I'm 5 minutes late to a rehearsal - I'll post something else here to this thread in the next day or two... Gotta run!!!

Hadn't realized that this had come out by itself?? I thought "Power to the People" was only available as part of the big Joe Henderson "Milestone" box set, or as as some sort of import (I thought I read from Italy - ??). Anyway, I'm pretty sure it isn't available as a regular domestic release from OJC/Fantasy. (It wasn't in their on-line catalog anyway.) Appreciate the offer, undergroundagent. I already have the Joe "Milestone" box, but might take you up on it. Lemme think about it. (We can take it up through PM's or e-mail.)

OK, maybe you've got it on CD, as part of a big box set, or now-long-out-of-print import, but what about your jazz buddies who don't have it, and can't get it without paying a mint for it on eBay??? OK, what albums do you really wish were not only on CD, but on CD in the U.S. (or in your part of the world), in a nice "reasonably" priced single-CD format (meaning not available only as part of some huge box set), so that you could easily tell other people "they gotta get this one!!!". One that comes to mind is Joe Henderson's "Power To The People", which is probably my favorite non-Blue Note release from Joe. Another one, that will be fixed soon (in October!!!) is Larry Young's "Mother Ship!!" What albums should be easily available to everyone, for a decent price??? - that currently aren't!!!

I both agree with you, Noj, and disagree too - in different ways... To the extent that cultural pride in one's ethnic heritage (sometimes) can resemble something more like the "I'm better than you are!!" nature that fans of pro and college sports often demonstrate... I agree, totally. IMHO, pride in one's own 'group' (however that group is defined) can certainly take on an unpleasant tone, at times. But, much of pride in one's cultural heritage is often wrapped up in foods, music(!), decorations, dance, folk-art, folklore, and shared history. I think it's hard not to appreciate to the collective culture of dozens and hundred's of years of tradition within a particular cultural community (sometimes even thousands of years). And I don't think that celebrating these sorts of things necessarily reduces the value of other cultures not being celebrated. (Meaning a Cinco de Mayo street festival isn't an expression of the lack of worth of Japanese culture, for instance, or the lack of worth of any other non-Mexican culture.) But, getting back to my sports analogy, I'm totally with you, Noj, in one respect. Extreme pride in one's self because of some loosely defined association (as in the simple case of rabid sports fans of a particular team), is often pretty ugly (IMHO). And the same thing goes with someone thinking that they're really 'bad', with lots of attitude about it -- simply because they're Black, or Chicano, or a German 'skin-head', or a Cubs fan, or any of 1000 other examples that you can probably find in most cultures (or sub-cultures). I guess it all depends on the intent behind the expression of pride in one's self, when that pride stems from something other than individual achievements. (PS: And no, Noj, I don't think you're coming across 'badly'. I think this is turning into a good discussion!!)

I mostly lurk at AAJ, and I don't check it nearly as frequently as here. For whatever reason, it seems that the jazz-related threads on AJJ are of less interest to me. For instance, shortly after I joined, I did a search on the AAJ board for topics about Andrew Hill, Charles Tolliver, Woody Shaw, and/or Larry Young - and I found very little discussion about any of these guys. Hill especially - how can a jazz board not really ever talk about Andrew Hill??? Seems also that there are are a few people on the AAJ board (not many, but a few that post fairly often) that have some pretty strong opinions about what "is" jazz, and what "isn't" jazz --- or at least what is "good" jazz, and what isn't "good" jazz. And those kinds of arguments really don't do much for me. The vibe here is a bit more "everyone can like what they want to like" in terms of music, which is good. (FYI: I certainly have lots of strong opinions about what I think is good, and what isn't - but I don't think it does any good to screw-up a perfectly OK thread that someone else has started. In fact, sometimes I find I learn something I didn't know, and I'll go back and check out something I previously had dismissed.) Although, I might say that I'm getting a little bit tired of the amount of political conversation here (specifically the number of political threads, vs. the number of other threads). I'm not suggesting any kind of action be taken to change this, but I am entitled to my opinion. Some days it seems like half the traffic on the board is in the "political topics" area. Often I think it just bogs down the board, and turns off other jazz-interested people from sticking around. Just my opinion.

I think some of it depends on how other people choose to interpret "pride in one's cultural background" when they see it, and to some degree it also depends on how that pride is expressed (certainly). My father-in-law is about 75% Swedish, and my wife is probably 40% to 50% Swedish too (can't remember the exact percentages of my mother-in-law's background, but she's a little bit Swedish too, maybe as much as 25%??) My father-in-law in particular, has quite a bit of pride in his cultural background, with a few "dala horses" around the house... My parents are both mostly German, and they have a fair amount of pride in their background too. (Of course they are 200% American when it comes to discussions about WWII, and take no pride in that part in German history.) I was adopted, so I have no idea what my exact "bio-cultural" background is, other than I know I'm a typical Euro-mutt of some sort. I take some pride in my parent's German heritage, but probably not any more than I take some pride in my wife's Swedish heritage. I guess I mean to say that I've seen all kinds of various 'while' European-Americans taking pride in their cultural backgrounds, in ways that don't necessarily say "We're better than everyone else". I think some of it depends on the kind of 'filter' people look at these cultural expressions through. I can choose to be 'put-off' by the notion of "Black Power", or I can choose to recognise that there are probably some logical reasons for how and why the notion of "Black Power" came to be an expression used in this country, both politically, culturally.

Just wanted to take a moment and thank everyone who has replied to this thread, for keeping the tone of it in the realm of "constructive ideas for change". Since I know lots of these kinds of discussions can easily devolve into finger pointing, where each side blames the other for the causes of racial problems, I sincerely want to say "thanks" for helping to have a reasonable discussion. And to those of you who haven't replied yet, I want to further invite you into the conversation. You don't have to have all the answers, or any of the answers for that matter. Just your observations and thoughts on the topic are more than welcome. Thanks!!! -- Rooster T.

There are tapes of Ornette jamming with the Dead, from when Prime Time opened for the dead in I think around '88 or so. I used to have a couple of them (may still, buried in boxes, haven't heard them in years). Anybody else heard these??? Pretty interesting to hear Ornette in a more conventional context. I seem to remember him playing in a typical Dead "space jam" kinda thing, but also on one or two more 'normal' songs.

OK, regardless of the content of the picture, I think that images in signatures are a pain in the ass. I don't care for this one, sure, but I didn't care for the pac-man one either. Somebody said it up above, that Avatar's should provide more than enough repetitive graphical content for anyone's needs. BERIGAN, if you like that picture that we're voting on so much, make it your Avatar. Or better yet, I wish the board moderators could disable graphics from signatures. IMHO...

Reminds me, I've occasionally wondered what atonal country music might sound like!!!??????

Anybody heard this CD before?? Jimmy Woods is on it. Here's The AMG review... "Back to Avalon" (recorded in 1960, not released until 1995):

See the recent Teddy Edwards (R.I.P.) thread for discussion of an obscure album that Jimmy Woods was on as a sideman...

Conan's 'Late Night' Breaks the Mold published 02:01 PM - MAY 09, 2003 Eastern Time Here's the dirt on Conan O'Brien: His show has been remodeled in clay. In the grand tradition of "Celebrity Deathmatch" and "Wallace and Gromit," NBC's "Late Night With Conan O'Brien" has been transformed into clay animation for an episode that will air Thursday night (May 15th, 2003). "This may be the best show we've ever done," O'Brien declared Friday _ "in clay." The episode, in production for months, is a clay recreation of a "Late Night" hour that aired in its original, live-action version last October _ including the show's opening, monologue and even lead-ins to commercials. Guests on the episode (which airs Friday at 12:35 a.m. EDT) are "Jackass" star Johnny Knoxville, comedian Richard Lewis and musical guest David Bowie. In addition, Mr. T appears in a sketch. ___ On the Net: NBC Web site: http://www.nbc.com

Great question!!! There's already a fairly long Jimmy Woods thread here (on this very board)... Jimmy Woods - CONFLICT, first U.S. CD release, w/ bonus tracks!! I'll bump it up so it get's into "Todays postings" too... (I figure we might want to add to that thread, rather than start another Jimmy Woods thread.... )

I voted for ETCETERA, but from this particular set of 10 conns, BASRA would be a close second for me.

So it isn't just me. What do other people see????

Just found this article from the Kansas City Star, about (of all things) Kansas City... Posted on Fri, Apr. 26, 2002 KC is perfect example of segregated city, Harmony Week speakers say By KEVIN HOFFMANN The Kansas City Star Kansas City's mostly white suburbs and mostly black inner city epitomize the fragmentation of races that many cities in the nation face, a panel of experts on race relations said Thursday. Hundreds attended the Harmony Week luncheon at Crown Center to listen to a panel discussion on issues such as race, class, education, urban vitality and sprawl. The luncheon served as the centerpiece in a weeklong celebration of Kansas City Harmony, an organization that works to build better relations among racial and ethnic groups and ensure equality in the workplace. The panel consisted of John A. Powell, a civil rights law professor at the University of Minnesota; Philip Olson, director of urban affairs at the University of Missouri-Kansas City; and Janet Murguia, executive vice chancellor for university relations at the University of Kansas. All are authorities on civil rights issues. Powell opened the discussion with a quote to remind the audience of the importance of dialogue in uniting people of different ethnic and racial backgrounds. "If we were all the same, we wouldn't need dialogue," he said. "And if we were all different in every way, dialogue wouldn't be possible." To show how Kansas City resembles a case study of the nation's segregated cities, Olson told the audience that in 1880, Kansas City had six voting precincts, each with a black population of at least 15 percent. "That is a far cry from today," Olson said, pointing to the most recent census data showing that 90 percent of Kansas City's black residents live south of the Missouri River between Troost Avenue and Interstate 435. Civic and business leaders need to find ways to break up that fragmentation, the panelists said, if Kansas City and other cities want to avoid the types of racism that still plague the country today. Powell suggested solutions such as one tried in Maryland. There, government officials agreed that they would not allow any development in areas without existing infrastructure. As a result, Powell said, Maryland has seen many successful redevelopment efforts in urban areas. But education and economic opportunities ultimately play key roles in making a region such as Kansas City whole, the panelists said. Murguia said that ethnic groups such as Hispanics tend to migrate to areas where jobs are plentiful, often low-paying jobs. "A lot of times, tied to those low-paying jobs are lower expectations from our young people," she said. "We need to make sure we don't get our young people stuck in that track and that there is no reason they can't go onto higher education and professional jobs." Murguia used herself as an example. She grew up in the Argentine neighborhood of Kansas City, Kan., with six siblings and a father who was a steelworker and a mother who never worked outside the home. Most of her siblings now are lawyers, and Murguia has held several jobs in the political arena, including working as a deputy assistant to former President Bill Clinton.

I can see A.B.'s attached image just fine, looks like the gargoil/bat thing, and animates just fine. Both IMG's in my original post still look like the "Image Hosted by..." thing...

FYI, now that I've actually created the thread, I can NOT see the first IMG above. Both IMG's look the same, i.e. "Image Hosted by..."

Berigan, still can't see your Avatar. It still says "Image Hosted by tripod www.tripod.com". Funny thing, though, is that I can right-click on your Avatar (the one I can't see), and can get the URL for it, which is.... http://members.tripod.com/~Anne_F/fungarg.gif And then I can past that address into my brouser, hit 'return', and I can see it!! Looks like a gargoil/bat kinda thing, with wings and green eyes, and a tail. Yes, it's animated. Hmmm... Wonder if I can post that picture as an IMG... Yup, I can see it when I post it as an IMG, and bring up the thread. (Or least it worked when I did 'preview post'.) Not important, but I'm guessing you're tired me me mucking up your other threads periodically about this. ========== HMMMMMMMMM......... Now THAT's interesting.... I just clicked on the link above (where I spelled out the URL of your Avatar), and a new window popped up with the "Image Hosted by tripod www.tripod.com" image, which looks like this.... http://members.tripod.com/adm/interstitial/remote.gif Does that give any clues??? ========= Now that's even more interesting - cuz when I did another 'preview post', now the Avatar image (the first IMG above) doesn't show, and I can only see the "Image Hosted by..." thing again.... Now I'm even more confused....