Big Beat Steve

Not something I would have picked up, sadly. And 50s-60s Eurojazz platters have been rare as hens' teeth at all times anyway (and then there were certain Asian pillagers who exploded the price levels for good ... ) But let's get back to Shirley Scott now.

Above all a case of availability and demand. If I had had the opportunity of making the rounds of the typical fleamarkets, garage sales, thrift shops and secondhand record stores in some fairly major metropolitan area of the USA (particularly if on either coast) in the, say, 90s and very early 2000s for any (though limited) length of time I probably would have had to rent a 20-foot container for shipping my hauls (across the board, music style-wise) back here. 😁 In short, essentially ZERO comparability overall.

What has held ME back was the relatively outrageous prices of her VINYLS over here. I've had an original European pressing of "Misty" with Eddie Lockjaw Davis for some 35 years, scored a Europan original of "Blue Flames" with Stanley Turrentine about 6-7 years ago, but otherwise .... Never the right items at the right price at the right moment, it seemed ... Then, as a a stopgap solution I took the plunge and bought (along with a couple of other RGJs) the Vol. 2 set on Real Gone Jazz ("Six Classic Albums") cheaply through Amazon a couple of years ago and found Vol. 1 ("Seven Classic Albums") on RGJ just as cheaply at a local secondhand record shop not long ago and have never looked back for some of my late-night listening since. (Yes, some may sneer at those RGJ European PD sets, but they are very useful introductions to an artist and can always go into the car player when really decently-priced vinyls come my way.) Still looking for some of her collaborations with Jaws (beyond the "Cookbooks" 1 and 2) now.

Amazing ... Not just for the guitar and its history itself but for the research that probably only serial number geeks and factory archive archeologists can value for what it is ... (I think I can at least halfways ... I've done things like this at times in automotive history )

I now downloaded a bunch of the smaller zip files too to complete wha ti had already downloaded individually. Thanks Hopkins! 👍 Does anyone know of any similar online source for the METRONOME magazine? archive.org doesn't seem to have anything.

Of course, I understand ... And no big deal back then ... But seeing how often reissues - particularly in more recent times - reverse and alter the "leader" or "name" credits (in a rather superficial attention-grabbing effort) it's often a bit unfair to those who actually were the leaders. And it not only falsifies the history of the mujsic but IMO the full appreciation of the artists as well because it does help to be aware of who played what and at what stage of his careeer and development as a sideman (as opposed to his role as a leader). As for the quote from your buddy : What would he have said about Art Tatum, then, I wonder?

Thanks for bringing this (back) to everyone's attention. The tune (along with the entire session) is more easily available (offline, i.e. outside YT) on Xanadu 124 (Bebop Revisited Vol. 2).

Yes, re- Dameron, all this is known. My entry to Tadd Dameron were his "Mating Call" LP (which to this day I correctly file as a Tadd Dameron and not as a John Coltrane LP - regardless of what reissuers out for a fast "name artist leader credits" buck pretended later on), and soon thereafter the "Miles Davis in Paris 1949" LP on CBS. And eventually, of course, the Dameron recordings featuring Fats Navarro which abound with his catchy phrases that a melodically creative musician should be able to spin on and on. All this is very accessible Bebop. To me, anyway. And these recordings are not the only ones. So I am not sure where Ethan Iverson is coming from. All I was trying to point out, however, was that Tadd Dameron recordings of his own tunes where the paino is THE major featured instrument (to fit the discussion or samples here) did not come that immediately to my mind. Contrary to Dodo Marmarosa. P.S. See the error of your budding jazz lover classmate? You say he claimed Dameron "played with Trane". Not so. If we are talking about "Mating Call", Trane played with HIM. Big difference. And honor to whom honor is due. I wonder anyhow which pressing got your classmate on the wrong track back then. Cannot have been the Prestige/Bellaphon 7745 pressing that was ubiquitous at the time. Nor previous issues/reissues (7070, 7247) in the Prestige catalog.

Actually I was thinking of Tadd Dameron too when I wrote my comment about Dodo Marmarosa but did not take the time to check out which of Dameron's recordings were really prominent piano features. I agree, though, that his compositions are a good entry point.

Very interesting and much more rewarding than the very idea of managing a useful newbie introduction into any new subject within 5 minutes. (Anyone wondering why the age-old U.S idea of "Get to know Europe within 48 hours" did NOT die the merciful death you had figured it had succumbed to decades ago? 😁) But I am wondering about this: "The complete absence of serious be-bop on my list is intentional. Most civilians need some basic exposure to the vibe before going in on Bud Powell or his children." Is this really so? Bebop being that difficult? I am not at all sure if it was my exposure (certainly much more than basic) but there are quite a few 40s piano recordings by Dodo Marmarosa that I found immediately accessible and catchy. OK, so some might say Dodo "isn't one of the all-time greatest of greats, so ..." but still ... the music speaks for itself so IMO to the unknowing any "gateway drug" introduction that catches their ears should do.

Fresh Sound!! Actually what' s listed on YT as an "alternate take" of "Cracklin Bread" isn't one but a reworking of his tune recorded two years later for the Derby label.

Just pulled out my copy ... The are street maps showing the locations of various clubs on p. 37, 53, 69, 141, 197, 215, 236 but none indicate the Bodega. The map on p. 197 covers Cross Street but does not identify the Bodega Club. But on page 51 it says the club was on 15 Cross Street. And pictures of and from the Bodega are on p. 113, for example. Club 43 is listed on p. 37 and (at its final site) on p. 236.

I remember this website was spotlighted in a discussion here in mid-2022. After which I checked it out and finally downloaded a couple of missing 1954-55 issues (of which I have originals of about half of each year). And now I saw this ... Having been caught out with one or two similar online archive sites that all of a sudden went bust I now decided to act wholesale and am now on a downloading binge of the years most important to me. I have to download each issue separately but am progressing nicely ... 8 full years done within an hour and a half ... So thanks for the alert!

The Voldemort of 50s hipsterdom?

Well, maybe, then, I ought to pick a copy up if one comes my way cheaply. As mentioned in another thread a while ago, some years back I decided it was time to round up the Roulette Basie LPs (beyond the Atomic, Chairmen and Plays Hefti LPs I already owned), and within a short time most of them(French Vogue-Roulette reissues from the 80s) came my way at prrices too good to resist in a local shop's special offer bins. And the remaining 3 or 4 were bought via Discogs. That is, all of the instrumental albums (except for the one Strings album) as well as the LH&R, of course, but only part of the Joe Williams feature albums and none of the others as they ranked far down on my priority lists. So maybe a lookout for the Eckstine and possibly the Strings album might not be amiss after all ...

If there's anyone who knows, wouldn't James Harrod be the one?

Don't know too exactly about Mosaic's present direction nor about the finer points of the licensing negotiations they would have to restart even with labels/congolomerates they have dealt with before, but would it be the Mosaic approach to look just at what has been released before and not looking sideways towards alternate or unreleased vault items at all - across all these labels? Besides, not wanting to be too cynical, but at 90 and assuming he wanted to make the things happen that you may be alluding to, do you think Quincy Jones would be able to make THAT many things happen that he would risk dying broke with the (statistically remaining) mileage he has got left? So ... things apparently being the way they are, and looking at a "released master takes only" reissue package (according to your suggestions), what if, of all producers, Jordi Pujol happened to jump on the challenge? Would you renege on your hostility toward anything Fresh Sound and jump on the results, then? They did repackage and cover the National grounds for a start, after all (and no, I won't comment on the strict correctness of the "Savoy" title of that package 😞 https://www.freshsoundrecords.com/billy-eckstine-albums/2374-complete-savoy-recordings-2-cd-set.html BTW, looking at his discography and what you'd like to see covered, you forgot one label that should be included: his 1944 recordings for the DeLuxe label. "Only" 8 tracks from 2 sessions, but seminal items ... Particularly in between the Hines period and his National sessions. So where did DeLuxe ownership end up? With whoever now owns the King roster, I guess. Did Mosaic ever do King recordings?

Well, what does it say about the Mosaic clientele after all, then, if their records at least were not immediately singled out as selling poorly whereas - according to the Cuscuna quote earlier - the Sarah Vaughn and Dinah Washington sets DID sell poorly? (And no, I am not the biggest Four Freshmen fan ever either ) Besides - your lobbying for Mr. X-tine is all very well and certainly totally honest in your intentions, but shouldn't you know better than this?? "That's no excuse on an Eckstine set. The released material is a finished product. From Hines through National, through MGM, through Mercury, through Roulette, it should all be there. Collate it, clean it up, get some good liner notes, and the set makes itself, I think. " Look at past Mosaic boxes and judge for yourself how often lack of multi-label access to the reissue rights has been advanced as an excuse (or explanation) for a set NOT being comprehensive in the actual discographical sense of the word and how unlikely or unrealistic the ABOVE approach therefore would be for a project on Mosaic, of all labels, anyway, even if there were sufficient reissue interest to start with? 😕 BTW, and FWIW, talking about the "jazz content" of Mr B, any forumist in good ol' Europe (to keep shipping affordable) happen to have a vinyl of the below LP flying around that they want to unload? https://www.discogs.com/de/release/3484446-Billy-Eckstine-Sings-With-George-Shearing-Quintet-Woody-Herman-And-His-OrchestraMetronome-All-Stars- Years ago when I bought vinyl more regularly on U.S. eBay it happened every now and then that U.S. sellers used dud record covers as padding inside the record mailers. And one day a record arrived from the US with a fairly clean sleeve of the ABOVE one - of all Eckstine platters - inside the mailer as one of the padding layers! No record inside, of course, just the cover. Wonder what this dimwit of a seller was thinking ... Yes I might have used it as a music room wall decoration item, but still ...

Fascinating! 👍

Not to forget his account of the 1962 Benny Goodman tour of Russia. 😉 https://www.billcrowbass.com/to-russia-without-love.html

That's the "Chicago Sessions" LP I was referring to in my earlier post. The above session makes up sides 3 and 4 of this reissue: https://www.discogs.com/de/release/6584810-Dodo-Marmarosa-The-Chicago-Sessions The "Dodo's Back!" LP above corresponds to sides 1 and 2 of this "Chicago Sessions" twofer.

Was this one of the tracks of the Russell band backing up Louis Armstrong or one of the features for the band all by themselves?

Trying to round up anything on record by Dodo Marmarosa became natural for me as soon as my interests in bebop developed. Like Al Haig and George Wallington (maybe even more so) I enjoyed his output immensely from Day One (and still do). The twists in his melodies - particularly on his Dials - are fascinating. Luckily his leader dates were easy to come by in the 80s on reissues on Spotilte, Raretone and Phoenix Jazz (plus some more here and there elsewhere). I eventually also rounded up his somewhat later recordings (when he resurfaced again briefly) - "Chicago Sessions" and "Jug & Dodo". And of course his two releases on Uptown ("On The Coast" and "Pittsburgh 1958") were a must too. The interview excerpts included on Uptown have him sound rather down to earth and relaxed - not crazy. (Mellowed with age, maybe?) (At any rate, the antics described in the starting post don't really sound worse than those of many other nut jobs - not jerks - in the business) For an even more comprehensive explioration of his work, this is useful: https://www.amazon.com/Flights-Vout-Bug-Dieter-Salemann/dp/1593933371/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1676618142&sr=8-1 Though my copy (clearly a print-on-demand publication) has a silly page layout (unnecessarily small print and silly wide blank margins).

Of course ... My reply was directed primarily at this forum, of course. And I know I cannot escape the "old guy" status either in the long run. Although I actually doubt that all that many who THEN listened to jazz (read: "then-current jazz") were really fully aware of Billy Eckstine and his output in 1975 or 76 when I got hold of that record I mentioned. His recording companion Sarah Vaughn - yes, likely. But him? Not quite so sure.

Don't know about the majority of others but I for one have known the Eckstine vocal version since my very early record buying/collecting days at age 15/16 as I had been given a 50s Guest Star compilation LP that had this Eckstine tune plus "Blowing The Blues Away" a.o. and one by Sarah Vaughn plus a few instrumentals by a bogus-named big band. When I got my hands on the Swingtime ST 1015 LP in c. 1990 (and therefore a decent pressing of the tracks from the budget LP) these tunes stil sounded extremely familiar among the other "new" contents of the LP. FWIW, Xanadu LP 207 has a May 1945 AFRS transcription version of "I Want To Talk About you".