Rooster_Ties

See also: http://www.hitsongscience.com/, and especially also the FAQ Posted on Sat, May. 24, 2003 Hit Song Science just may be the future of popular music By JOAN ANDERMAN The Boston Globe A new company is trying to take some of the guesswork out of finding 'hit' music, with help from science and supercomputers. Already Hit Song Science is generating controversy, with some artists and record-label insiders saying it only highlights the desperation of a struggling music industry. Hit Song Science is a high-tech music analysis system that compares new songs to a massive database of chart-topping singles and predicts hit potential based on shared attributes. All five of the major record companies -- BMG, EMI, Sony, Universal and Warner Bros. -- are using the service founded last year by Barcelona-based Polyphonic HMI. A modified online version, geared toward songwriters, was launched recently at http://www.hitsongscience.com/. "Our technology is to music what X-rays are to medicine," says Polyphonic HMI CEO Mike McCready. "We help the record industry see their market and their music in a way they were previously unable to do." Hit Song Science technology isolates sonic patterns in a song, ranging from tempo and chord progressions to melody, harmony and pitch, and then predicts that song's success by comparing it to "hit clusters" gleaned from its database of 31/2 million songs. Ironically, HSS arrives at a moment when those in the music business face criticism that popular music is increasingly derivative and homogeneous. "This is just another reason why the music industry is going down the tubes," says singer/songwriter Ellis Paul. "We need to think on the edges, not down the middle." But McCready says his company isn't trying to encourage cookie-cutter music. "We hope we can help labels look at music that doesn't sound formulaic but will still return on their investment," he says. "For example, we predicted the success of Norah Jones' (Grammy winning) `Don't Know Why.' Nothing in our database actually sounded like it. Rather it was the combinations of patterns and properties that indicated hit potential." But Jesse Harris, the New York songwriter who composed "Don't Know Why," is skeptical. "It sounds like a coincidence to me," Harris says. "If they tell the label it's got hit potential and then the label puts lots of money into it, maybe that's why the song's a success." In addition to using HSS to choose album singles, labels are also utilizing the technology to help screen music submissions from unsigned artists and short-list those identified by HSS as worthy of a closer look. "It's a fascinating tool, and smart companies will use this as ancillary information," counters Jeff Fenster, senior vice president of A&R for Island/Def Jam Records. "But don't live by it," he warns. "There's more involved in how music connects than what can be read in lines on a graph."

There is really only one store in Kansas City with prices decent enough to purchase from, but only because I have access to a sort of "employee discount", even though I don't work there. Yeah, it isn't "fair", but I figure they get more of my money that way, than they would if I were getting all my music on-line. Actually, my buying habits have shrunk to almost nothing recently (since late last year), due to external circumstances. During that time, the one store in Kanas City (part of a regional chain) was bought up by another regional chain (back east). They're jazz selection is now controled out of some central office in New Jersey. Although they do get some new jazz releases in, it's hit or miss from week to week. None of the recent round of BN Rare Groove titles came in, for instance. And very few (if any) ECM's. Sure, I could order things through them, but why bother. I'm not buying at the moment, but I'm sure when my financial situation improves, I'll start getting most of my music on-line, since that's really the only way to go. I'll never pay Barnes & Noble or Borders prices, that's for sure!!!

Yeah, several years ago (mid-90's) I remember going to a few afternoon jam sessions here in Kansas City, almost always at the insisting of a couple friends who somehow seemed to love that sort of thing. Yikes, it was like pulling teeth to hear anything more than about the same 25 tunes, and even those were butchered - to put it mildly. Every piano player also sang, in seemed, which only made it worse. By comparison, even some national "smooth-jazz" acts are almost listenable, at least in the sense that they at least have some command of their instruments, on some level. The sad thing is the vast number of people for whom the weekend-afternoon jam session is what jazz is all about. That's pretty much what they think jazz is. Then again, for most of these people, the afternoon jam session is more of a social scene too.

I only mentioned Jackie cuz way back when, on the BNBB, I very politely and respectfully asked if anyone happened to know what McLean's ethnic background was --- and I got jumped all over quick, at least by a few people there. Something about the timing of my question, relative to some of Aric's typically "sensitive" talk about Race and Jazz. (I think it was only my 2nd week on the board, and I had no idea what can of worms I had opened.) Hence the 'winkie' thing.

Or Jackie McLean??

I cannot wait to hear this set!!! Jack Johnson (specifically "Right Off", and "Go Ahead John") are two of my favorite electric Miles recordings. Can't tell you how exited I am about the amount of unreleased material in this set. If I could rank the sets, specifically in terms of my interest in hearing unreleased material, I would have to rank the "65-68 quintet" box first, with the "Jack Johnson" box being a very close second. (Then probably the "IaSW" box third, and the "Miles & Gil" box fourth. "Bitches Brew" box fifth. Then a toss up between "Miles and Trane" and "The Middle Years - 60-65".) Again, that's my ranking based on my interest in hearing previously unreleased material. "Jack Johnson" is some baaad stuff, man, you dig!!

I'm also a big fan of architecture, early 20th Century, mid-Century, modern - you name it. Had to vote for the Larry Young for that reason. One of my favorites. I even like the all-blue version from Spain!!!

I've tried to change my about every other week or so, when the mood strikes me. I think most of mine have been classic album covers... Tyrone Washington's "Natural Essense" Jimmy Woods' "Conflict" right after I got it (the day it came out on CD in the U.S.) Andrew Hill's "Grass Roots" when it was my album of the week Joe Henderson's "Power To The People" Wayne Shorter's "Etcetera" Right now it's the cover of the newest release from Greg Osby, due out in early June (no, I haven't heard it yet). I try to change it up, depening on what kind of mood I'm in. My very first avatar here was this one...

Hot Damn!!! Can't wait to hear all the unreleased Jack Johnson era material.

I totally forgot about it too. In fact, I realized that I had forgotten about it on Friday morning, and had the chance to tape it when it was rebroadcast on Comedy Central later that same day, and I forgot that too!!!! So I never saw it either...

Thanks kdd. Your suggestion about not asking too much about the past might bode well for me asking some more open-ended questions, perhaps?? - like what his favorite albums are (of his own) from the 70's and 80's?? Also, surely by July he will have had a chance to hear a "test-pressing" (as it were) of the 1969 session that's coming out in October. Can't imagine that Blue Note would be releasing it, without passing along a tape of it to Andrew, since (apparently) Andrew is being consulted for his thoughts on what the title of the release should be, and presumably what he would like as titles for the two (I think it was two) as yet untitled tunes from the session. But your observation about Andrew being shy jives with my couple discussions with Jason Moran about Hill, and also with Hill's interview sections on the BBC radio-documentary (which is still available on Hill's own web-site, I might add). He does seem like a fairly reserved person, from my impression anyway. Not at all like Herbie Hancock, who seems to be much more extroverted (by way of comparison). What do people think of me asking about Hill's memories of working with Lee Morgan, Woody Shaw, and/or Charles Tolliver - who are just about my three favorite trumpeters, and especially their playing on more 'outside' albums, like Andrew's especially, for instance. Has anyone else here talked with Andrew personally before?? Care to related the experience for us?? Thanks!!

I'm really hoping to go hear Andrew Hill at the Iowa City Jazz Festival (Sunday, July 6th, 2003), and I'm gonna try like heck to speak with him briefly after his set. Yeah, to get a couple autographs, but I'd also like to ask him some questions too. I know I won't have time for a long "interview", but I am hoping to get to ask him 4 or 5 good questions, and talk with him for 10 or 15 minutes - if I'm lucky. A couple that occured to me to ask were about the process of adding voices to the two "Lift Every Voice" sessions. I'd be curious if the voices were over-dubbed, or if they were recorded in real-time with the other musicians. Also, does he have any reflections of the process of working with a small choral group? Also, if I remember right, the linernotes for "Lift Every Voice" mention some sort of jazz opera that Hill was working on. I wonder what ever became of that, and that might be interesting to ask about. Another good question might be to ask him what he feels are his most successful recordings during the 70's and 80's - if he could pick just one or two that he's particularly proud of. Also, maybe to ask if there are any musicians that he wished he had been able to work or record with, that he didn't?? Of course, I might like to ask him about the upcoming release of the slightly-larger-band recordings from 1969, with Woody Shaw, Dizzy Reece, and others. Maybe go over his other unreleased sessions, one by one, and ask what he remembers about each one?? (Might be a little tedious, though - and bring back some bad memories, either about the sessions, or about Blue Note not releasing them.) If you could ask Andrew Hill a few questions, what would they be??? PS: I live in Kansas City, and I'm looking for somebody (or more than one 'somebody' even) from the greater Kansas City area, who would be interested in going up to Iowa City to hear Hill in July (Sunday, July 6th, 2003). I've got another thread about this going in the "Live Shows" area of this board, but I thought I'd mention it here again too. Thanks!!!

My wife and I are in St. Louis this weekend, visiting my parents. We all went to a small-town festival (crafts, antique tractors and steam engines, country-cookin', etc...) today, and I just realized that of the nearly 500 to maybe as many as 1,000 people we saw today, both at the festival (out at the local fairgrounds), and in town itself, along with us being at a near-by lake, I don't think I remember seeing a single Black person the entire time I was there. Or if any, I'm positive the number was less than half-a-dozen. This was in a small town with a population about about 5,700, located about halfway between St. Louis and Springfield, IL (meaning about an hour's drive north and slightly east of St. Louis). But then I guess there are entire areas out in the country like this, meaning parts of Idaho, Montana, Nebraska, both Dakota's, hell - plenty of the state of Kansas is like this (out in the country, anyway). I know, I know - this ain't new news to anybody (and not me either, when I stop to think about it), but it was just something I hadn't actually experienced in quite a long time.

I think clearly the whole 'sales drop' problem can be traced back to the "Spanish/Time-Life" Blue Note series.

It's the solo-piano disc from about 1966, right?? I've always been meaning to get this one. I have both of Ra's other solo-piano dates, from about 1978 on IAI. I love them both quite a bit, probably nearly as much as any solo-piano recordings I own. But somehow, I've never crossed paths with "Monorails..." at the right time. I'd be curious what others thought of it as well.

This is for Jim in particular, but anyone else who wants to take it too... What are the opinions (pro or con) about Judi Silvano??? (Joe Lovano's wife) I mostly only know her from her contribution to Joe's Universal Language. On "Universal Language" she seems as much like a horn player as any singer I've ever heard. (Can't say I've ever heard Jon Hendricks before). I'm not suggesting that she's "the best" (or even necessarily "really great"), but was that the kind of "horn-like" singing you were getting at, Jim, in your prior post????? Certainly, speaking as a singer myself, I could never in a million years do what she does. I'd have to call her as least "pretty darn good", but again - I don't listen to much vocal jazz, so I don't have much to compare her with, for that "horn-like" singing style being discussed.

I think that's the cut my buddy played for me, come to think of it. Hey, who's Paul Whiteman??? Can somebody explain the comparison??

Wynton's recent first string quartet (At the Octoroon Balls: String Quartet No. 1) And thanks so much for that mega-long post. I post a ton here, sure, but I could only hope to provide 1/10th of the valuable insights you give us, Jim. Thanks!!!

Yeah, most of my thesis above wasn't plausable, but there are different DVD formats in different parts of the world. Who's to say that having different CD formats in different parts of the world isn't somebody's "bright" idea too. It'll never happen to music, cuz I know we're moving away from CD's as the delivery medium. But there are some real issues here, about music only being licenced for sale (and "consumption") in some countries, and not others. It's not very hard to imagine a future where all music is downloaded (or you go to a physical store, and they download it for you, and hand it to you, somehow). And, in that same future, you can only download certain music, depending on where you are. That's not at all hard to imagine. All those Japanese titles many of us own?? Imagine them being available for easy purchase by several million people on another side of the planet, but not available to you. Then, imagine some holy-grail recording you'd been looking for, for 20+ years. It's easily available across the pond, but there's no way for you to even import it here. You want to talk about being ...

Been nice having you on the board with us Kevin. Good luck!! - and use that one phone call you get wisely...

Getting back to my rant again, can you imagine there being multiple CD formats in the world, which would not play on players except in the countries where that music was "approved" for sale??? I know this is an insane example to give, but here it is anyway. Imagine, for a moment, that Japan has a differerent CD format the the U.S., and that you can only buy the Japanese CD players in Japan, and that there isn't any way to even import a "Japanese-only" CD player into the U.S., to play the Japanese format CD's. Iron-shut, nothing, no way at all to listen to any music released ONLY in Japan. And let's also assume that the various governments required to enforce such a thing were to crack down on any and all pirating of recorded sound of any sort, iron-clad, no low-fidelity cassette tapes even getting in or out of Japan, with any music not licensed for "consumption" outside of Japan. Now then, with those absurd assumptions in place, let's say BN/EMI releases the entire BN catalog, EVERYTHING, including a bunch of newly discovered unreleased sessions (including Tyrone Washington's infamous "Trainwreck" session - which it turns out is really amazing, and the stereo mixdown that Michael happend to listen to, were just fucked up.) There's a Herbie Hancock solo-piano date from 1966. There's three unreleased Woody Shaw BN albums from 1964, 65, and 66. You name it - skies the limit. Now, then, there's 100's of CD's that most of us would give our right arms and legs for, with NO way to get the music, and no way to even listen to the music. No way, other than to move to Japan, I guess. Yeah, this is a crazy proposition (especially with all the limitations I put, which are impossible to enforce), but if you take the idea of limiting the import of legally licensed product to it's insane but logical conclusion, then this is but one scenerio you can think of. As it is now, paying import prices for music is a pain in the ass, but that's the way it is. But to prohibit music (or any mass-produced artistic expression) from being available for purchase by some people, while other people have free access...... What else can I say that I haven't already said????

Reading much of this thread for the first time today, I have but one thought... Quick, somebody find Tyrone Washington!!! (Wishful thinking, I know.)

k.d. did a vresion of Porter's "So In Love" on the First "Red, Hot, & Blue" thing that was terriffic, and a live version on the Letterman show (a few nights after the airing of the RH&B TV special) that was stunning, full of the sultry melancholia that is often at the root of Porter's "best" songs but that most singers, for whatever reason, seem to overlook, and that the RH&B version only hinted at. Wish I had taped it. Yes, I have that RH&B CD, and that's exacty why I wish she would record a whole disc of Porter tunes. That one tune is stunning, and she has the voice of a godess, IMHO. (And that's coming from someone (me) who's not at all naturally drawn to female vocalists of that sort.)

I've heard very few Wynton sideman appearences (only one or two that I can think of), but a friend of mine played me one once (I'm struggling to remember who it was by - I'll have to ask him), and it wasn't half bad. It was something recorded less than 5 years ago, and there was a sort of fire to Wynton's playing that I've never heard on his own dates. Perhaps I need to pursue a few of his sideman dates, from what I'm hearing here.

or - take your pick... And read this (pretty please ), cuz I want some discussion about this... Either BN/EMI wants people to be able to buy these titles, or they don't. This shit about licensing music to be sold only through "certain" channels, and to certain people (in certain countries), really bites hard if you ask me. I mean, it's not like EMI didn't get paid for those titles to be released. (I presume, from what Kevin has said, that these are legit, from a legal standpoint.) So then, what the fuck is wrong with certain people (those very few of us in the U.S. who even know about these things) being able to buy a sorry-ass few of them over here!! (Rooster is really on a rant now, I'm afraid.) This reminds me of back in the early 90's, was it?? - When the Feds, or some government agency (who?) was supposedly going to crack down on the import of titles only released on CD in Japan or Europe (and not yet on CD in the U.S.), saying that it was illegal to import and sell them here, due to what I seem to remember as being called "parallel copyright law", or some such nonsense. I presume that went away, cuz now I see import titles available (at least on-line) 'everywhere', relatively speaking. Again, I get back to my original statement. Either EMI wants the stuff sold, or they don't!!! But let's not release something in one part of the world, and then get all pissed off when other people in other parts of the world want to buy it too. (And pay for it, it's not like we're stealing!!) I don't own any of these Spanish BN CD's, and there are only maybe three or four titles in the whole list that I'm in any way interested in. But to "crack down" of a few hundred of each these "slipping" into the U.S., and somehow eroding the future sales of those same titles at some "potential" future point in time... Who cares!!! Again, if the CD is legit, then EMI is already getting their money, no matter where the CD is sold, or what country the CD is imported into and resold. Sheesh... Does somebody want to explain this to me?? Is there some part of this that I'm not understanding?? I'm mean, these are legally licensed products!!! Is this somehow like the drug companies charging an arm and a leg for drugs in the U.S., and then selling the same drugs in Canada for less, and then getting all pissed off because (surprise, surprise!!!) people want to buy the cheaper versions of the same thing in Canada??? That may be one thing (and a topic better suited for the "politics" thread), but most of these Spanish BN titles (or at least the interesting one) aren't even in print in the U.S., and I really doubt we'll see vary many of them released here any time soon. As far as the common ones go, I figure that EMI is getting their cut, whether they're sold here or in Spain. WTF!!! [/rant] Whew, that feels a little better now... PS: [rant] I suppose this is like the multiple DVD formats that exist in the world, which only play on players in particular 'zones' of the world. I'm not talking about the difference between video formats, like PAL and NTSC (if I remember my acronyns right), but rather that there DVD's and DVD players are hard-coded to only play DVD's in the format "approved" for that part of the world. The sole function of this "feature" is to prevent importation of titles released on one continent, which are not yet "approved" for sale on another continent. Can you imagine a world 50 years in the future, where traditional books don't exist anymore (for new titles anyway), and everything is released for viewing on some sort of e-book appliance?? AND, the appliance has a GPS system in it, such that you can buy the e-book content, but you can or can't read it - depending on where you are in the world??? "Oh shit, I'm going on vacation to Italy, but my favorite mystery novel doesn't have it's licensing approved yet for Italy, so when I take my e-book with me on my trip, I won't be able to read it!!!" Laugh all you want, but that is what the DVD region encoding basically is trying to do, and trying to block to importation of legally licenced music is damn near the same thing, at least in principal. [/rant] And I don't even own a DVD player yet!!