John Coltrane with Eric Dolphy - Evenings at the Village Gate (July 14th release date)

[jazzbo]

That was released on cd as well. I think it may have been authorized. . . I don't ever remember Jr. speaking against it or releasing his own version as he had unauthorized releases.

[Ken Dryden]

I didn't think that Don Schlitten operated that way, it just seemed odd at the time I received the LP and read the liner notes.

[jazzbo]

Well, my SHM-SACD was going to be delivered today, but all of a sudden it's on hold in Customs in Cincinnati and now due Wednesday. Ah well.

[John L]

I just had a chance to hear this.  It is fabulous, a very worthwhile addition to the discography. 

I would not say that it is just "another day at the office."  Coltrane, Dolphy, and Elvin are in a somewhat different zone here than they would be later in the year at the Vanguard.  

Coltrane just burns it up on soprano here, so much so apparently that he made an unusual decision to stay on soprano even all the way through Impressions.  On only "Africa" does he switch to tenor.   If you, as I did, don't think that you need another Coltrane version of My Favorite Things, think again.   Dolphy also plays some great stuff here.  The microphone is close to Elvin.  So not a beat is missed.  

GET THIS!

 

[AllenLowe]

someone may have answered this - but I am curious, is this a mono or a stereo recording?

[John L]

16 minutes ago, AllenLowe said:

someone may have answered this - but I am curious, is this a mono or a stereo recording?

Mono and Lo Fi,  but with clarity of sound.  

[AllenLowe]

12 minutes ago, John L said:

Mono and Lo Fi,  but with clarity of sound.  

thanks - the horns do sound a little distant on my meager laptop speakers. Gotta get it on a full system.

[clifford_thornton]

Will definitely pick this up on CD. Don't feel any need to own a vinyl edition.

[sgcim]

They're having a group listen to this at the NYPL, and then some 'expert' will tell us what they think we should have thought of it. No thanks!

[Ken Dryden]

The period when Eric Dolphy was a part of John Coltrane’s group has long been my favorite. I am very much looking forward to this CD arriving tomorrow.

[jlhoots]

Mine is on the way too.

[mr jazz]

dl in the cue

[kh1958]

Mine arrived Saturday. LoFi to me is something like Bird at St. Nick's. This is quite clearly recorded, the only issue being the balances/relative volumes of the instruments.

Edited July 16, 2023 by kh1958

[Stompin at the Savoy]

 

 

[Robert Middleton]

I recently read that this was recorded at the Gate with a single overhead mic. So, very often, the drums overpower all the other instruments. The flute sounds very far away in the opening Dolphy flute solo of Favorite Things. Boy, I would have loved to hear that mic'd well. But the sax, being louder, is picked up much better. But overall the set is just killer. So much better than the recent Love Supreme set that I really had a hard time listening to.

However, I feel they're hitting the bottom of the barrel when it comes to Coltrane discoveries. The last truly great one was with Thelonious Monk at Carnegie Hall in 1957. Released in 2005. That recording was perfect. Maybe something else of that quality will be unearthed one day. But don't hold your breath.

You'd think with the advent of AI they could balance and equalize these recordings better. I suspect they will be able to do it soon. Then we'll hear re-releases of all these masterful performances as they were meant to sound. Here's an example of how it was done with Nirvana and Beatles songs. 

[Stompin at the Savoy]

I'm supposed to get a copy on tuesday but I listened to the album on Spotify today and liked it a lot.  Sound leaves something to be desired but really not that bad.  Hey, how'd you like to go to a club tonight and hear Coltrane and Dolphy?  The music is rather similar to the Vanguard dates made soon after but this has the feeling and enthusiasm of the artists doing their first take in this configuration, or so it seems to me.  Less polished perhaps than the Vanguard recordings but very spirited.

Edited July 17, 2023 by Stompin at the Savoy

[mikeweil]

My copy is supposed to arrive within the next hour ... 

[colinmce]

11 hours ago, Stompin at the Savoy said:

I'm supposed to get a copy on tuesday but I listened to the album on Spotify today and liked it a lot.  Sound leaves something to be desired but really not that bad.  Hey, how'd you like to go to a club tonight and hear Coltrane and Dolphy?  The music is rather similar to the Vanguard dates made soon after but this has the feeling and enthusiasm of the artists doing their first take in this configuration, or so it seems to me.  Less polished perhaps than the Vanguard recordings but very spirited.

This is about my impression after 4 listens. I appreciate that the notes (which are uniformly excellent) don't try to overinflate the contents, emphasizing that not only is the classic Coltrane quartet only newly in place, but Coltrane's performing relationship with Dolphy, especially as it relates to this new direction, is at the beginning of its fruition. It is not hard to hear the difference between this performance and the ones from later 1961 onward-- they are definitely feeling this music out. So I appreciate it on that level.

[mikeweil]

It's here, and I listened to the first two tracks. It gives a good impression of how the quartet sounded live at the Gate, engineer Richard Aldersons's notes are a great read and leave nothing to be desired as far as information on the sound is concerned. Elvin was loud, but that's what Coltrane wanted him to be.

Edited July 17, 2023 by mikeweil

[clifford_thornton]

2 hours ago, mikeweil said:

It's here, and I listened to the first two tracks. It gives a good impression of how the quartet sounded live at the Gate, engineer Richard Aldersons's notes are a great read and leave nothing to be desired as far as information on the sound is concerned. Elvin was loud, but that's what Coltrane wanted him to be.

yes, I imagine the sound is pretty accurate in terms of experiencing the live balance -- of course, nothing can really put you "there" unless you were there, but it's probably close. Elvin was loud and Dolphy as far as I know hadn't really played with him until working with Coltrane, so was probably still adjusting.

Alderson's engineering is interesting -- to me it seems much more documentarian than stereophilic, and I appreciate that while knowing that for some settings it isn't ideal. But I like what he did on ESP and Prestige (and Reprise -- he was Tom Rapp's go-to recordist, from what I understand).

[ghost of miles]

4 hours ago, colinmce said:

This is about my impression after 4 listens. I appreciate that the notes (which are uniformly excellent) don't try to overinflate the contents, emphasizing that not only is the classic Coltrane quartet only newly in place, but Coltrane's performing relationship with Dolphy, especially as it relates to this new direction, is at the beginning of its fruition. It is not hard to hear the difference between this performance and the ones from later 1961 onward-- they are definitely feeling this music out. So I appreciate it on that level.

I've listened to it only once so far (planning to do so again tonight), but also have the same impression, that the group is still cohering.  (It's also not quite the classic quartet yet--Reggie Workman and Art Davis are on bass, rather than Jimmy Garrison.)  Exciting music, especially once you get used to the mic placement that brings Elvin to the forefront so prominently.  I love Dolphy's long flute intro on "My Favorite Things" (like John L, pleasantly surprised that I so enjoyed a newly-discovered version of that particular set staple) and am looking forward to spinning the whole album at least several more times.  

[Chuck Nessa]

Interesting chronology:

Africa Brass - session #1 - May 23, 1961
Ole - May 25, 1961
Africa Brass - session #2 - June 4, 1961
Village Gate - August 1961
Village Vanguard sessions - November 1, 2, 3 & 5, 1961

[Pim]

56 years ago Coltrane died. I decided to make my little music room as a place of honor to the grandmaster this week

[jazzbo]

Well, my copy has been on custom hold in Cincinnati since Friday. This is unprecedented. What are they trying to smuggle to me with that SHM-SACD?

[ghost of miles]

53 minutes ago, Pim said:

56 years ago Coltrane died. I decided to make my little music room as a place of honor to the grandmaster this week

Very nice shrine to Trane! I've also been meaning to revisit that Ayler box.  (Good Lord, was it nearly 20 years ago that that came out?!)