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duaneiac

The All Things Van Morrison Thread

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On 10/6/2019 at 2:53 PM, duaneiac said:

New album due out October 25 --

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After an initial listen to the new album, I like it.  The standout track for me is "Dark Night Of The Soul", which, if there were no post-production wizardry involved, displays a remarkable fluidity to Mr. Morrison's voice for a singer of his age.  Whatever else he has done during the past 50+ years as a rock star, he has taken good care of his voice.  This is made even more apparent as this song follows a duet with Bill Medley of The Righteous Brothers fame.  Mr. Medley's voice is not bad, but it does sound weathered, more like one might expect the singing voice of a 78 year old man to sound.  "Up On Broadway" is kind of cool because it's not the Broadway you're thinking of.  This song is about Broadway and the North Beach area in San Francisco which is apparently a favorite spot of his.  Mr. Morrison includes another grumpy old man song (how young was he when he first began singing grumpy old man songs?) here called "Nobody In Charge".  To spare you from having to listen to this diatribe, let me just summarize it as a variation on the middle-aged white man blues called, "I Demand To Speak To The Manager".  It's a good album overall.

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"Sir Van Morrison has accused the government of "taking our freedom" in three new songs that protest against the coronavirus lockdown.

In the lyrics, he claims scientists are "making up crooked facts" to justify measures that "enslave" the population."

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-54194498

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oh boy.

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Well we never said he was sane. 

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25 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

"Sir Van Morrison has accused the government of "taking our freedom" in three new songs that protest against the coronavirus lockdown.

In the lyrics, he claims scientists are "making up crooked facts" to justify measures that "enslave" the population."

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-54194498

Sad .... si tacuisses philosophus mansisses ....

Edited by soulpope

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The last gig I did before the pandemic was with a drummer who had recently come off the road with VM. I hope he's okay...

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Age doesn´t make us wiser automatically  - on the contrary.
 
 

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He's now gained my respect.  Speaking truth to power and all that.

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Morrison has produced some of my favourite music. Astral Weeks, possibly my favourite album. Over the years I've accepted that he was a curmudgeonly reactionary and squared that with my enjoyment of his music as I don't hold by having musical heroes.

However I find this episode deeply disturbing. Peddling lies is not 'speaking truth to power', it's highly irresponsible as more lives are lost here and in other countries.  My only compensation is that he's largely irrelevant to the wider population so that his infantile but dangerous rantings will go largely ignored.

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There's a musician I befriended in college and have been facebook friends with for a long while.  He has also been an anarchist, an anti-vaxxer and a Bill Gates conspiracy theorist for some time.  I choose to disagree, but also choose not to cut of the communication line.  He's also one of the strongest opponents of racism I have ever known, and it's strange to see him falling into agreement with the creeps that carried guns to the Wisconsin state capitol.  He doesn't support Trump.

I'll extend the same indulgence to Van, who has provided many musical highlights to my life.  I haven't heard the songs in question yet, but are they really more offensive than Under My Thumb or Blurred Lines?

Artists are allowed to be wrong.  Artists can even have serious flaws and still bring value through their art.  No boycott for me.

 

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Van got screwed by actual gangsters early in his career, not surprising that he's a little paranoid.  Yeats and many others believed some crazy ass shit too.

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"truth to power"....I think that "truth" always ends up being somebody telling you what you think to be true, whether it is or not, but this whole "to power" thing, uh...you make a record, you're speaking to your audience not any real "power". Music industry powers give a fuck about how much you sell. Real-world power don't give a shit about you or your record.

Eartha Kitt spoke her truth to actual power and that was that. Helluva lot of good that did.

So let us, please, stop romanticizing the pop stars, past, present, and future.

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1 hour ago, JSngry said:

"truth to power"....I think that "truth" always ends up being somebody telling you what you think to be true, whether it is or not, but this whole "to power" thing, uh...you make a record, you're speaking to your audience not any real "power". Music industry powers give a fuck about how much you sell. Real-world power don't give a shit about you or your record.

Eartha Kitt spoke her truth to actual power and that was that. Helluva lot of good that did.

So let us, please, stop romanticizing the pop stars, past, present, and future.

Yes no matter what they think. Add professional athletes to the top of that list.

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For better or for worse, Van has always been his own man.  Judged solely on the basis of his music, he's in my all-time Top 10.  How many other musicians have remained relevant for as long?  He's always been cranky...that's just his nature.  I saw him in the late 60's at the old Paramount Theater in Portland, Oregon.  After about a half and hour, he stopped the concert and called out the crowd for taking flash pictures. Then he sat down on the stage for 15 minutes to make his point.   Me?  I'll gladly put up with his idiosyncrasies in deference to music like this:

 

Edited by Dave James

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19 hours ago, randyhersom said:

There's a musician I befriended in college and have been facebook friends with for a long while.  He has also been an anarchist, an anti-vaxxer and a Bill Gates conspiracy theorist for some time.  I choose to disagree, but also choose not to cut of the communication line.  He's also one of the strongest opponents of racism I have ever known, and it's strange to see him falling into agreement with the creeps that carried guns to the Wisconsin state capitol.  He doesn't support Trump.

 

I know a fair amount of musicians that fall into the same camp; most are around Van's age. I tend to disagree with their conspiratorial mindsets but value my connection with them as people and artists.

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I certainly understand the impulse to censor.  I can no longer listen to Pink Floyd because of Roger Waters's anti-semitic ravings, and have difficulty listening to Elvis Costello because of his anti-Israel, pro-BDS stance.  I respect Van Morrison for his point of view.  The science is nowhere near as settled as the near-monolithic views here might imply.  Consideration must also be paid to all the people (musicians included) who are losing their livelihoods and careers because of broad lockdowns, and somehow a balance must be struck that includes all divergent needs.  Van is 75 years old and therefore part of the most vulnerable demographic; if he insists strongly on this, perhaps it's not based in "paranoia" or a "conspiratorial mindset" - maybe people can disagree on how to interpret the science and the best paths for moving forward.

https://nypost.com/2020/09/18/by-the-numbers-its-hard-to-see-how-lockdowns-saved-many-lives/

Edited by mjzee

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Time to tune in to that "T.B. Sheets" marathon!

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I've found his music interesting at times through the years (love the "Too Late to Stop Now" live set and some of the other early 70's stuff), but he's never struck me as someone I would want to hang out with.  But then, he probably wouldn't want to hang out with me, either ;).   

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The expanded 'Too Late To Stop Now' is a gem, not least for the DVD and Van's hilarious attempts at a high kick. Music is peerless.

I suspect that Dante had something to say about hanging out with Sir George Ivan.

1 hour ago, mjzee said:

I certainly understand the impulse to censor.  I can no longer listen to Pink Floyd because of Roger Waters's anti-semitic ravings, and have difficulty listening to Elvis Costello because of his anti-Israel, pro-BDS stance.  I respect Van Morrison for his point of view.  The science is nowhere near as settled as the near-monolithic views here might imply.  Consideration must also be paid to all the people (musicians included) who are losing their livelihoods and careers because of broad lockdowns, and somehow a balance must be struck that includes all divergent needs.  Van is 75 years old and therefore part of the most vulnerable demographic; if he insists strongly on this, perhaps it's not based in "paranoia" or a "conspiratorial mindset" - maybe people can disagree on how to interpret the science and the best paths for moving forward.

https://nypost.com/2020/09/18/by-the-numbers-its-hard-to-see-how-lockdowns-saved-many-lives/

People might be a bit more inclined to listen to him if he didn't throw phrases like 'Fascist bullies' into the public arena. Not a lot to respect there, I'm afraid.

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1 hour ago, mjzee said:

I certainly understand the impulse to censor.  I can no longer listen to Pink Floyd because of Roger Waters's anti-semitic ravings, and have difficulty listening to Elvis Costello because of his anti-Israel, pro-BDS stance.  I respect Van Morrison for his point of view.  The science is nowhere near as settled as the near-monolithic views here might imply.  Consideration must also be paid to all the people (musicians included) who are losing their livelihoods and careers because of broad lockdowns, and somehow a balance must be struck that includes all divergent needs.  Van is 75 years old and therefore part of the most vulnerable demographic; if he insists strongly on this, perhaps it's not based in "paranoia" or a "conspiratorial mindset" - maybe people can disagree on how to interpret the science and the best paths for moving forward.

https://nypost.com/2020/09/18/by-the-numbers-its-hard-to-see-how-lockdowns-saved-many-lives/

So you're quoting that  great scientific journal the New York Post? 

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4 minutes ago, medjuck said:

So you're quoting that  great scientific journal the New York Post? 

Did you read the article?

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5 hours ago, mjzee said:

Did you read the article?

Yes it's a crock of shit-- like most things in the NY Post. 

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The figures stated in the article aren't necessarily all wrong, but it fails to make the appropriate analysis: that it's still largely impossible to compare casualties or number of infected individuals between countries - and may very well always be. This is because the matter is much more complex than most would like it to be, especially if there's an agenda (political or otherwise). 

Countries have been testing people to such a varying degree and by such different criteria that it's mainly pointless to compare those figures (number of infected individuals per country). And the number of casualties, which in many countries peaked quite early, depended on much more than the lockdown approach. How did the infection get into the country? When and to which areas did people go on vacation (where they got infected)? What is the average population density? How do people in crowded areas commute; by bus, train or car? 

I do not think that all the early decisions were wise in Sweden, but I agree with the initial stated ambition - that measures must be sustainable, maybe even over several years.

Edited by Daniel A

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On 18/9/2020 at 8:27 PM, medjuck said:

Well we never said he was sane. 

If I should remove all the music because of the beliefs of musicians, I could sell my hifi system tomorrow with no harm.

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